THE XDL SHOW, December 3, 2005 - Irwindale Speedway

[AllMotorKing]

everyone and their mom was talking last year about producing a big x type event here in the states when the video footage was released online.

at least paramax is committed to actually producing the show. i'm interested to see how this event turns out.

[hatebbobbarker]

this really doesnt sound that exciting, a couple months ago i knew they were plannign something, but didnt know what. kind of dissapointed that its this.


toobad they didnt bring JGTC again this year, that was the most fun ive ever had over three days.

[Suede Mr. Flash]

Kenta from Big X has been over here in the US on several trips this year, and was working on several leads to bring Big X over here from Japan. He was much closer than many people might believe...

the sad thing is that someone from Paramax called up Kenta and asked him a bunch of questions about Big X, then they finalized and announced this XDL not even a month later. Kenta didn't really know any better, and now has no legal recourse. He got screwed. plain and simple.

that's not cool.... this industry is too small for that crap

What the hell are you talking about Jacob?

Nobody stole ANYTHING from ANYONE. XDL is not a copy of Big X. If you think it is, you don't understand what THE XDL SHOW is and you have never seen Big X. Jeez dude, do a little research before you shoot off on a forum like this.

But for the record, yeah we talked to Kenta (and for that matter, directly to Kumakubo too) but it quickly became clear that there were too many complications, costs and politics to make ANY part of Big X viable here as part of THE XDL SHOW. Believe me, we would have LIKED to have Kumakubo and company here (at least the drifting team) but financially and politically, it was too complicated and the benefit to us was too low to justify the cost. It was NOTHING against Kenta personally. I've known Kenta since well before he represented Big X and I maintain a friendly relationship with him to this day. There is nothing personal here, just business. We simply couldn't afford Big X and it didn't really fit our vision for how we want XDL to be. Does that mean I don't ever want to see Big X here? Hell no! I'd love to see it here. But someone else is going to have to pony up an awful lot of money for it and that just ain't gonna' be us. I'll be glad to buy a ticket though and come and enjoy the show!

Not only that but the Big X motorcycle element didn't fit into our vision for THE XDL SHOW at all. We decided that our stunt bike element, being a relatively new sport to the U.S. (compared to Europe where it is well established and very advanced), should be represented by the world's best SPORT BIKE riders, and ones that are SUPPORTED by FACTORY or other major sponsorships. Do you have any idea of the caliber of Kevin Carmichael and Kyle Woods (not to mention the other riders we will feature) in the stunting world? What's that...no? Hmm...well you will after XDL.

Big X may have some good riders and some cool bike stuff but it offers nothing in the same format or in the same league as what we are after.

"what sucks is that they called a bunch of their "friends", asked for some help and suggestions, then took the ideas and ran with them without paying any consulting fees..."

^LOL^

What "friends" are you referring to? Don't all event ideas start this way, by networking, discussions, gauging reactions, etc.? We talk to a LOT of people and bounce things off of them, but I'd LOVE to hear who we supposedly took advantage of from your perspective.

Where do you get this stuff? Hell, if I had a dime for every free piece of advice I've dispensed over my 20+ years in this industry I'd retire! That's part of the biz. Ask anyone who knows me. Ask Kenta for God's sake! He has asked me for plenty of advice and information in the past and I've always been forthcoming with it. Maybe he didn't particularly LIKE my advice, even if it was valuable and true. Who knows? But I share all kinds of information with people all the time, whether I think they are going to like what I have to say or not...no charge!

If Kenta has a problem with us or thinks we screwed him somehow, he knows he can talk to us. If there is some misunderstanding between us, we're all adults and will work it out. He doesn't need you to "defend" him. He knows how to reach me and he knows he can, any time.

But hey Jacob, in your defense, you have this much right. "...this industry is too small for that crap". Amen brotha'! It's also too small for people who post a bunch of smack about things they know nothing about. 'Nuff said on that.

For hatebbobbarker: As for no Super GT (JGTC) this year, well, that was not our choice but thanks for the props on the 2004 event. Just too many unavoidable issues related to logistics and scheduling with Japan this year. Anyone who has ever brought ANY show from Japan understands that the complexity and difficulty, not to mention the cost, requires a virtually perfect scenario to make it viable. Such was not the case this year but we will be doing more GT LIVE stuff in 2006, but in a slightly different format. Maybe some of it with SGT, maybe not.

In the mean time, I think the exhibition and entertainment format of THE XDL SHOW will be a lot of fun for people to watch. You will see things you've never seen before. The fact that's it's not a competition format will give the drivers a chance to do things they usually can't do. Of the drivers we have signed that have expressed their opinions on this, they are really looking forward to doing some stuff that will blow everyone away. Mark my words, THE XDL SHOW will not be gentle on the tire supply. Plus there will be a lot of other stuff to do there, much like GT LIVE. More will be announced soon as well.

Check out more at http://www.xdlshow.com

Peace, out.

Mike

[Double M Star]

Seriously... why dramatize it at all.

Look at how Formula D has surpassed the D1 series here in America.

Formula D has reached further than D1, due to a differant management team.

We should not get our panties in a bunch over someone else's investments to bring us something fun and another reason to inhale rubber.

If you're seeking blame, blame yourselves for loving the sport too much.
Too much so that there is demand for more events.

[Mike Peters]

drifting has so much drama , i just wanna kill tires and marry anna kournikova.

[AllMotorKing]

there were a lot of people thinking of producing a big x type show here in the US before anybody ever even heard of Big X.

i think the only similarity XDL has to the Big X is that it is a show that has choreographed drifting in it. all the other elements are different. i'm going to check out the show because it looks interesting. If Big X comes to the US, i'm going to check that out as well.

you can't blame paramax for being first to market w/ this type of exhibition/show event.

[Double M Star]

Just enjoy the destruction of vulcanized rubber.

[yukio@jic-magic]

I went to see this show on Saturday. For all the hype that was around it, it was somewhat disapointing. I saw a huge vendor area, with nothing in it, really. If I had to guess the number of people that were there, I would say around 500 (IF that). The ride alongs with the drift cars was an absolute great idea. Also with the test runs of the Miatas was a great idea too. BUT, I think it would have been more entertaining if there was some "grudge match" or a mini drift competition.

I was hoping to see more drifting demos and such. I had no idea where the stunt bikers were until I went into the stands and saw them on the 1/8 mile drag strip.

There was no car show at all. A bunch of Scions and that's it.

It was a high concept, good features, but for some reason, wasn't able to pull it off as it was hoped to.

[BlackBox]

I went to see this show on Saturday. For all the hype that was around it, it was somewhat disapointing. I saw a huge vendor area, with nothing in it, really. If I had to guess the number of people that were there, I would say around 500 (IF that). The ride alongs with the drift cars was an absolute great idea. Also with the test runs of the Miatas was a great idea too. BUT, I think it would have been more entertaining if there was some "grudge match" or a mini drift competition.

I was hoping to see more drifting demos and such. I had no idea where the stunt bikers were until I went into the stands and saw them on the 1/8 mile drag strip.

There was no car show at all. A bunch of Scions and that's it.

It was a high concept, good features, but for some reason, wasn't able to pull it off as it was hoped to.

I would have expected a TON more then that. Now I am glad I didn't travel down to it. Does anyone have any Pictures?

[kumasan616]

I would have loved ot go, except I am saving for the D1 show plus its in the middle of finals time for me (papers, tests, etc.), so I could not find the time to break away. Too bad, too, sounded like an awesome concept! I will for SURE go to the next one!

[Slapshotnerd]

I would have expected a TON more then that. Now I am glad I didn't travel down to it. Does anyone have any Pictures?

we took over 400 pictures between two photographers (both of us have shot more than 10 drifting events this year alone). i think we had a TOTAL of 20 good shots between the two of us. the lighting was the worst lighting i've ever shot in. The SEMA drifting exhibition which was in a makeshift parking lot with rented lighting has much better lighting than this event, which was thrown in a full stadium. All of the photographers who were in the same pit I was in kinda gave up after the first few minutes of drifting. for a 2 hour main event, i think the photographers were trying to shoot stuff in the first 15 minutes. Then we all just stood around and froze our asses off for 1 hr and 45 minutes, begging the corner worker to wave the flag to stop the course so that we could leave the track and handle our business (for me, that meant peeing. I've never held it for so long! hahaha)

[yukio@jic-magic]

I was there from about 7am and I hung around as much as I could, watching kids driving Miatas (trying to drift) and looked around but honestly, after 3pm, I couldn't take much more and my patience ran out. As much as I wanted to hang around and watch the "main event", my friends were bored and so I left with them.

I wish I could have hung around, but I think that there was more entertainment when it came to drifting. Again, I loved the concept, but I think it would have been better with the Miatas driving around in the parking lot and more drifting and such in the main oval.

I would like to see more events like this but have more companies involved with the drifting aspect.

[UNITEDMASTER]

Hello,I was there as a vendor UNITED DRIFT SHOP,the crowd was small and sporadic,not much track action cause the falken boys and the JDM guy were supposed to do 30 min demos throughout the day starting at 9:30 or so wich did not happen the main grand stand was pretty much empty all day.Formula D's booth was half way set up other vendors were facing all different ways a little unorganized.The drift ride alongs did not last long.I was expecting alot more from the JDM boys I know this was an excibition but come on,and the bikes were cool but I saw all they had to offer on FRI,cause on SAT they actually did less.Overall Drift Asso did a very good job as far as the production goes, it was just lacking content,but remember it was an inaugural event so this type of thing can be expected,also I think it was tooooo close to D1. Just my thoughts please dont fleme,peace

[Suede Mr. Flash]

Hey All,

Well, let me start by saying thanks to everyone who came out and supported the inaugural XDL SHOW. I also appreciate the feedback we received at the event, here, and elsewhere. I would like to address some of the concerns and opinions voiced here.

I guess the most difficult part of this event has been for us to convey that this first event was more of a test, or a "pilot show" (if you will), than a full-scale event. While we would have liked it to be everything to everyone right out of the box, we were experimenting with a lot of new ideas and concepts and there was a lot going on behind-the-scenes that may not have been apparent on the surface. In addition to the whole bike and car stunt show concept, something that has never before been attempted on this scale, everything there from the shared course time between the experiential attractions (Mazda Circuit Drive and Falken Drift Experience), the whole concept of public ride-alongs in pro drift cars in the Falken Drift Experience (another first as far as we know), to the giant audio system, the stage type lighting (a lot of which fried during the show), integration between the audio, lighting, MCs, video crews and the Jumbotron display, the live S14 build-up in the BFGoodrich Build and Boost, the photo hole cut into the front straight catch fence, and even stuff like the staff assignments and rotations of all the various staff and volunteers, as well as countless other little things that we were "playing" with to see if it would work.

It quickly became apparent that in order to bring all of these elements, ideas, riders and drivers together at the same time in the same place, we would have to make this an "event", rather than a private practice or something like that. Remember, a lot of these guys came from all over the world, and all over the U.S., which required the type of resources you can only tap in to if you are having an event. If we had just tried to arrange a private practice, none of this would have ever happened.

So from that aspect, it was a success to us because now that the drivers and riders have been here, performed together and have a better idea of each other's capabilities, they ALL want to do it again and do it better. All the planning and crap on paper would have never brought us as far as one simple event could have. That was a huge part of the equation and a huge, but necessary, risk on our part. If you read some of the posts on Club4ag.com about the event, you'll likely see a different perspective than what you have read here, mostly because the people involved in the event knew what the agenda was and knew the objectives were achieved.

http://forums.club4ag.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=124487

Anyway, as far as specific comments here, let me address them.

Jacob, I'm really bummed that you didn't seem to know that the infield sucked. It was never intended to be a photo spot for the main event. All I can say about that is this:

We tried to make this clear on both Media Day (in the media orientation meeting) and on event day. If you didn't get word on this, I apologize. Had you been there on Media Day, you would have known this. That whole infield area was originally closed off completely for a reason. Did you notice the nice big 70' hole we had cut into the front straight catch fence in front of the main grandstand? That was made for a reason, because we knew that would be the only good shooting spot after sunset. You have no idea what I went through to get the speedway to agree to that. But they did it and it worked really well. Those who shot from there got a ton of good stuff. I had two guys shooting for me from there and they both got a lot of great captures.

On event day, I was getting HUGE pressure by shooters to get out on course, inside the K-rail compounds, as though this was a traditional drifting event. So I made a deal with the Drift Association guys, who were running the course, that if any shooters wanted to get out there, they were to be told that, A) The vantage point sucked, and B) You would be trapped out there for the duration of the track activity until the course was cold.

Either you weren't told this (however, my sources say you were) or someone on our side failed to give you the "speech" before you went out there.

It's not like I'm insensitive to photographers. Jeez, I've probably shot more cars and events in my life than you ever will. I had a photo area policy for a reason and I broke it to try to satisfy a few individuals and that was a mistake. Regardless, thanks to you for (once again) blurting out your opinion in a public forum before contacting us first for at least a comment or "the other side of the story" (as any good journalist would), this won't happen again. From now on, I will just stick to my original plan and make that area off limits to ALL shooters, period, no exceptions. If anyone argues with me in the future, I'll remind them of this thread. I tried to accommodate some special requests and I got burned. Won't happen again. 'Nuff said.

To yukio@jic-magic, you have a lot of valid observations and we appreciate it. One thing you should consider though is that we didn't open the public gate until 9:30AM, which was intended to keep people from getting burned out too fast as the on-track stuff didn't really start until 10:00AM. I hope you can see it from the typical spectator point-of-view, rather than from the "insider" view of someone that had access to the facility at 7:00AM, long before the gates opened. If I had been in our shoes, I would have been toast by 3:00PM too (actually, I probably was. I can't remember).

Nonetheless, you have a lot of other valid points that we agree with. There needs to be more on-track entertainment based stuff. The 2 hour "main event" was difficult for people to understand so in the future we will probably do a couple shorter exhibition segments and mix that up with the experiential stuff so there is something for everyone even if you don't spend the whole day there. For this first event though, we were not sure how long the cars would last, what the bikes could do or how long their tires would hold up and a lot of other variables that were unknown. So we did the single "main event" to maximize resources and learn as much as we could about "MTBF" with both the bikes and cars. But you are right. The next time it will be a shorter but faster, more high impact show that occurs at least twice during the day rather than once.

As far as the Circuit Drive being on course, rather than in a parking lot, that was part of the plan to make the experience more fun and appealing. I think anyone who has done a lot of ride & drives probably gets bored with the "cones in the parking lot" thing. So we wanted to do something different by hosting it on the "main stage" of the speedway. It's tough at Irwindale Speedway though, or any 1/2 mile oval venue, because there isn't enough room to lop a section off for one thing while something else is going on in another part of the track surface. So we had to do this shared course timeline, which actually worked well and ran on-time and gave the cars a chance to rest between thrashings

I know a LOT of people who did the Circuit Drive really liked the whole feeling when they came on course and were suddenly surrounded by the sights and sounds that are usually reserved exclusively for race car drivers. Our philosophy about events is to always make them a cool EXPERIENCE, and that includes the sights, sounds and sometimes even the smells! Hosting the Mazda Circuit Drive on the track, rather than in a parking lot, was a calculated part of providing a much richer experience for an average person off the street. Granted, for us in the industry, who have been on that track a thousand times, it isn't that exciting any more. But if you look at it from the perspective of a first-timer or an average consumer, having the Circuit Drive there takes on a whole new meaning. One thing we know, even with the relatively low spectator count we had there, the Circuit Drive ran at capacity in every single session.

The vendor midway was a tough one. We had some quality participants but the quantity was admittedly low. When we first scheduled this event, we had a lot more support from the industry but a lot of things came up that made the interest wane, not the least of which was the sudden announcement right after our date was released that D1GP was going to be 2 weeks after. The PRI show hurt us too as a lot of tuner companies were there this time which was unusual. But again, this first event was a pilot and mostly for the teams to get acquainted and for us to experiment with a bunch of new ideas so we didn't let the exhibitor/vendor issue, nor the expected spectator count, impede our main objectives.

The bikes you saw on the drag strip on Saturday were not performing, they were practicing. That was because the rain on Friday cut our practice short (among other problems it caused) so the track management let them use the strip to get a little more practice in on Saturday before the main event. That being said, we agree that it would be cool to have a few stunt bike exhibitions scheduled throughout the day in addition to the two main event shows that will be on the course with the drift cars. These stunting exhibitions, however, would be in a smaller space, somewhere in the midway perhaps (where we basically make a K-railed off space), so people can watch them up close and really get into the nuances of their stunts, something that is difficult to do in the main show. Again though, we needed feedback from the riders on the feasibility of adding this to the schedule which was one of the objectives of the first event. We needed to make sure they could handle that many sessions (physically and mentally) and that their bikes and tires could handle that much stuff in one day. Our post-event feedback from the riders we have spoken with indicates that this WILL be possible so we will be adding that in to future shows.

Spectator count was just under 2,500 total. There were a lot of transient spectators, which was unusual to us. A lot came right before the main event. Not a terribly exciting number, especially after our huge success with GT LIVE and also the February 2004 D1GP I produced, but not entirely unexpected and certainly not the focal point of our objectives for this first event. Believe me, we did NOT want to go up against the USC game or HIN VIP but we really needed to hold this event before the end of the year and the 12-3 date was basically all we had available that worked for everyone that was part of the show. In the future, we'll pick better dates, including some in the Summer.

To UNITEDMASTER, I'm not sure where you heard that the "JDM boys" were supposed to do "30 min demos throughout the day starting at 9:30" but that was never on the schedule nor announced or promoted. The grandstands were expected to be empty all day, until the main event at 5:00PM. The "experiential", or "participatory" activities we had on track all day, as fun as they were for the people DOING them, were a bore to watch. So that was not unexpected to us. Hopefully the information you had on this did not come from us because we never had anything like that in the plan or schedule since the beginning. Interestingly enough though, it IS something we are considering for the future! Maybe you saw something in the crystal ball before we did

You are certainly on-target with your other comments. This was probably too close to D1. I won't get in to all the reasons why. It's a long and boring story but bear in mind that even though the date sucked for exhibitor and spectator draw, we had other objectives that needed to be achieved with this first event that may not be apparent or on-the-surface. Also, thanks for letting me move you a couple spaces to the east at the last minute to accommodate your neighbor who showed up with a trailer we were not expecting. I hope that was not too much of an imposition and I hope the extra passes we offered helped offset the inconvenience.

I hope you will consider participating on future events we do because the people and companies that supported our inaugural event will get special privileges in the future, with either XDL or GT LIVE events. Even though we made it cheap/easy for companies to come out to this event, I know it's a lot of work and takes staff and resources so I'm all about reciprocation in the future. I try to take care of people who take care of us, including United Drift Shop. Cool?

A few other observations we made.

With regards to the motorcycle side, I discovered the stunting world, particularly on the west coast, is at about the same place with the public as drifting was 4 years ago. Very new and relatively undeveloped. BUT, it does have factory backing and funding which should make it easy to get them caught up to the drifting world very quickly. The motorcycle O.E.s that were at XDL were thrilled with the whole concept and future and they saw it for what it was, a pilot program.

We had good media participation too (just over 100 there on event day, both automotive and motorcycle) and some of the coverage has alredy been reproduced on both the web and in print.

According to Irwindale Speedway management, we had one of the best run privately promoted (track rental) events they have ever had and a lot of what we did will become a model for others who come after us. Everything ran on-time, without incident and there were no operational problems or issues except for the finale when some of the motorcycle guys doing burnouts melted holes in the asphalt on the front straight which forced us to shut down before we were totally done. But it's all a learning process for everyone so no big deal. After a little confusion and time for the smoke to clear, we just went straight into the big Happy Birthday thing for Orido which blew him away. He loved it.

If you didn't get to hear the audio we installed, you missed something amazing. Yes, it was too loud at times but for once, you could actually understand everything and "feel" the music. I guess I'm torn on the volume issue because if you go to almost any major sporting event today, the audio is unbelievably loud so that is "normal" to a lot of people. But I also agree that that sounds of the cars and bikes should not be overshadowed by the PA announcements and MCs. We'll have to find the right balance there.

We did have serious issues with some of the special lights we had installed but again, a learning process and something that almost couldn't be anticipated since the rain on Friday prevented us from testing any of the lighting or sound until event day.

So that's the story from behind-the-scenes. No excuses. Just the facts and some observations. We are looking forward to taking the next steps by developing THE XDL SHOW into a small series before taking it into a paved baseball stadium. In case you didn't know, that is our long range objective. We want to do for drifting and stunting what Supercross did for motocross. We already have stadiums interested, we already have a plan for paving them and we are going to work towards that by holding several more "test" events and building a small series before we have the stunt show polished up enough to justify taking it into a venue like that. Have you seen the FIA Race of Champions in France or any of the WRC special stages in 2005 that were in paved stadiums? Same basic concept except with drifting and stunt bikes. Sounds like fun. eh?

Sorry for the long post but thanks for reading and we hope to see everyone at the next XDL SHOW which will be announced soon.

Cheers!

Mike

[Slapshotnerd]

that's alot of reading. i'll read it all in a bit (i'm at work right now)...

but not only did I not get word, but nobody else in the spot I was at got word. This included shooters from Super Street, Import Tuner, Import Racer, Drifting magazine, Urban Racer, J-Tuned, and several other top companies. If i was the only one out in that location shooting, then I'd believe it. But I was out there with a handful of the industry's top shooters. To say that we all got the wrong word might be a bit of a stretch...

ok, back to work, i'll read the rest later.

edit - ok, i read it all. and i understand where you're coming from on some of these issues. You have your $.02 just like I have mine. It's all good

the reason I didn't come out on friday for media day was the same reason you weren't able to test the lighting - the rain. In addition, the timing just didn't work out. I get off work at 2am, often get home at 3. It would have taken me an hour to get to the venue due to the traffic on the 605 at the morning rush hour, and I didn't feel like getting up at 7:30 for a quick press conference and demo run. Had you scheduled it in the mid or late afternoon, I would have been there. But that's more than you probably care to read about.

As I told you at SEMA - if you guys throw an event which involves drifting, I'll probably be there because I have an interest in being there to shoot pictures. But when I see some problems, I'm going to voice my opinions.

on a side note, the D1 schedule was published for quite some time. we knew in february that the event would be in mid december. and this year, they've let us know even further in advance. When was the date for XDL finalized? because I just heard about it in September or so...

PS - i have a lead on some bike stunters, let me know if you're interested. we're talkin 500 foot stoppies, 5 person endo's, etc....