Redline TV (Feedback/Improvements?)

[craiglieberman]

How unfortunate....

...that Nissanguy was countered with logical answers and RESPECT and he's resorted to this to save face.

Bro, I started off humble, polite and respectful. By some, this courtesy was not returned. I responded in a professional manner and tossed a tenth of the sarcasm others did, so for anyone to cry 'foul' is pathetic.

This is not and never was a popularity contest and while you may not think I should have, I'm happy to go tit for tat with the narrow minded all day long. Don't like sarcastic answers? Don't make insulting accusations.

As I've stated repeatedly, if ANYONE has any CONSTRUCTIVE feedback, they should offer it.

A few, NIssanguy included (who started off sane and rational) apparently didn't like when I shut down a few know-it-all members. Perhaps you were dissuaded by my logic and true-to-life answers and responses to myths and misconceptions. After all, every explanation I offered or notion disproved made someone else lose face. Can't have that....can't have an outside be right, can we?

So be it, but your poll is as unprofessional as it comes. Next, you'll try to have me banned from posting here.

The greatest irony here is that some of us from the Redline crew came here looking for insightful, meaningful input. I can see now that that's not what we're getting.

The unprofessionalism and lack of decorum displayed by a few means that we will simply look to others to help shape the program into what they want to see. Tragically, that may mean that the balance of Drifting.com members lose the opportunity to help channel their creative energies into this program and create something we can all embrace, enjoy and help grow the sport....all for the narrowmindedness of a few who try to be cool.

I'm just trying to remember now if I knew as much about the world at 21.....

To those who DID offer meaningful input, we thank you. Keep your emails coming.

[tight_corner]

Nissanguy lol if u look close its says OWENER NOT ME and car...

lol i wish it was mine tho

I just want to say somtin I am 14 years old yes i am young so wut....


i came to Canada when i was 11 Since 8 to about 10 years i drove my moms rear engine front wheel drive car it was fun and fast. Light body but slow motor. This is the car... So what if it looks *Censored**Censored**Censored* it was like my little go kart tops speed of 160km.... and 4 speed manual....



pic

[tight_corner]

Re: How unfortunate....

Originally posted by craiglieberman
...that Nissanguy was countered with logical answers and RESPECT and he's resorted to this to save face.

Bro, I started off humble, polite and respectful. By some, this courtesy was not returned. I responded in a professional manner and tossed a tenth of the sarcasm others did, so for anyone to cry 'foul' is pathetic.

This is not and never was a popularity contest and while you may not think I should have, I'm happy to go tit for tat with the narrow minded all day long. Don't like sarcastic answers? Don't make insulting accusations.

As I've stated repeatedly, if ANYONE has any CONSTRUCTIVE feedback, they should offer it.

A few, NIssanguy included (who started off sane and rational) apparently didn't like when I shut down a few know-it-all members. Perhaps you were dissuaded by my logic and true-to-life answers and responses to myths and misconceptions. After all, every explanation I offered or notion disproved made someone else lose face. Can't have that....can't have an outside be right, can we?

So be it, but your poll is as unprofessinal as it comes. Next, you'll try to have me banned from posting here.

The greatest irony here is that some of us from the Redline crew came here looking for insightful, meaningful input. I can see now that that's not what we're getting.

The unprofessionalism and lack of decorum displayed by a few means that we will simply look to others to help shape the program into what they want to see. Tragically, that may mean that the balance of Drifting.com members lose the opportunity to help channel their creative energies into this program and create something we can all embrace, enjoy and help grow the sport....all for the narrowmindedness of a few who try to be cool.

I'm just trying to remember now if I knew as much about the world at 21.....

To those who DID offer meaningful input, we thank you. Keep your emails coming.

YO man you make a ghay rice show with a eclipse on airbagsa nd lambo doors if u have that then its ghey


if u want a good show have a guy or two guys starting a 240sx project on a budget of 7 grand or somtin then i wont miss an episode

[nissanguy_24]

Listen Son... and i call you son because i think your about as mature as my 12 year old cousin.. Trust me you did not want to see the first draft of my post.. Besides yeah a boycott is unprofessional.. Gee whats next? a strike for better wadges? How childish!

You keep asking for input! we gave you tons! now all your looking for is compliments! you wont find any. All you want is for us to talk about how great your little show is. its not going to happen. This was about the show but it turned into a thread about you when you started comming off as an *Censored**Censored**Censored*. And yes i turned on you because you began to personally insult my friends and people i respected. You didnt take our advise but rather told us how much better you were, and told us why you were better then us.

Ah if only i knew now what i did when i was an aging washed up jerk desperating trying to keep my name and hands in whats fresh new and "hip".

Perhaps your just trying to stay on top of the wave of popularity that drifting has become out of a desperate attempt to keep from realizng the inevitable. You have aged and lost touched with whatever scene you claim to have a hand in. You claim to know about drifting but you dont know anything about drifting. Your not a drifter, your just a guy trying to fit in. I get the feeling you never did.

Your arguements at least could pretend to hold validity before you bagan to personally attack me for standing up to your idiocy. Every letter you type is digging you deeper and deeper. everytime you insult someone you turn someone else of to your show. But mainly my problem with you is this....

You think we need you, in actuality its the other way around. At least our pro drifter friends understand that. They know with out fans there would be no pros. Yet you seem to think that with out your input there would be no drifting. no fans.. You have it wrong, i get the feeling you always did.

People dont act like you expect because you expect them to love you.... it doesnt work that way...

Welcome to the real world son.

[Ghost of Duluth]

I see some valid points in what Craig is saying, the only problem with it is that you said it here. See, alot of people on this forum are not about the flashy side of the Hin's and the Import world. The fact that your name leaves a bad taste in the common man's mouth doesn't help you much either. You are seen as the worlds biggest sellout. Personally, I don't care, you do what you want to but other people get a little tense when people who tend to be over the top flashy start poking their mitts into the pie. You are wel known for in the industry and not all of it is good. I saw your website where you wanted to charge out the rear end to put peoples car on a registry for motion picture companies. I don't know how successful that was, but I don't think it took off too well. Now you have a show on TV that shows the Import world. But to call it "for Drifters by Drifters" just seems like your latest attempt to put your foot in the next fad. If you would have just made your import show and left it at that and stuck some Drifting in it, maybe you wouldn't catch this much flak. I will watch the show though and make a better formulated opinion though.

Also, you and your money don't impress alot of people here. Money is great, I love to have it, but this isn't the cool guy country club, your Porsche and Uber widebody M3 don't impress people here. They are impressive cars i'm sure in a different circle, just not here. Also since your show is for Drifters, by Drifters, this is the target audience that you are trying to hit and you are alienating them. They don't like you even more now that you have come on here and badgered them. Probably would have been a better idea to let it lie and count your money. Not a good idea to try and get honey by stirring the bee's up.

Also, coming down on Nissanguy was probably not the best way to go about getting your point across. He is a little agressive when provoked about something he care's alot about, but then again we all are. Just like you with him, he spoke his mind and since it was about you and you didn't agree, you were just as agressive as he was. Since you are the elder in that since and you claim to have been in Drifting for 18 years, you should have be old enough to know violence begets violence. You egged it on just as badly as everyone else did when you attacked his credibility. Who really cares if he doesn't post his real name, it's a web forum. You can't hold that against anyone. Just so happens that he has a genuine love for the sport and gives good advice and is a great moderator. No need to besmirch his name to away from yours.

Now for the flip side. Everyone here needs to understand that people in business and show business do NOT think like you do. They don't see trends and fads as wha they truly are. Underground scenes that have caught on. They see things in dollars and cents. They see what they can get out of something rather than what they can put into it. They say they want to help the sport along, but if there was no money to be made, they wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole. You cannot blame them for that. While you and I get satisfaction out of doing it, they get monetay satisfaction. Everyone gets something from a fad or trend, some just get different things. The most hardcore shop see's money to be made too. If they were doing it before the explosion, then they are just getting the fruits of their labor. Everyone gets something. As for TV coverage and other stuff like that, alot of the people don't want that. They don't want the attention, they would rather no-one ever hear of it so they can continue to do it in peace. While we both know that will never happen, that's what they want.

I think big money in Drifting is great. I think it will bring better parts, develope better RWD platforms and in a sense, bring about a re-incarnation of the Musclecar/Hot Rod era of the late 60's, early 70's. Who cares if they are Japanese cars, they are still musclecars of a sort. I would like nothing more than to get into the business end and try to shape Drifting into a visible and acceptable form of motorsports. These kids are talented and that talent needs to be showcased and showcased in a way that let's other kids know that keeping it safe is the way to do it. Maybe one day I will get that chance.

Don't hate on Craig because he see's money to be made. He is just doing what he thinks is best. I see money to be made too but wouldn't sell out the entire sport to make it. His sponsers have determined that he is the person that can help them make the most money. I say his track record is a good one for that. He can make the money. Like I said, nothing wrong with that. The sponsers will either see the truth or not. Odds are they will make alot of money and then run along when things start to dry up. Nature of the beast.

So Craig, if you are happy with what you are doing, then do it. Alot of people here are not happy with it. You can't please them all. But please don't patronize the sport and shout that your show is for Drifters by Drifters because from what I have heard, it's not. Like I said, I will watch it and make my own decision. But to me, from your track record, you hop fads and when Drifting is dried up and no money is to be made, then you will move along and find the next cash cow. As I stated, for you that's well and good, but don't expect the people who love the sport to swallow that pill without water. It just isn't going to happen.

[Ripper]

waste of time

man, you guys should stop argueing cuz i just lost all my exercise time just reading this thread after i came home . wow it started off as 16 pages - 18 pages reading this thread. seriously guys, no more okay?
well, i'm leaving and when i come back from this compter this thread better not go up to 20 pages.

[P1STON2ROTARY]

The greatest irony here is that some of us from the Redline crew came here looking for insightful, meaningful input. I can see now that that's not what we're getting.

This is sad, and it shouldnt come to this.

quoted by Mr. Lieberman.

I did not come into this forum searching for opinions, I came to respond to bogus assumptions, myths, misinformation and questions.

Contradiction?

This site is probably the largest group that you would come to for feedback. Honestly, we will gladly give you feedback based on your tv show not your image. This non stop arguement has nothing to do with your television feedback and should have been kept out at day 1. Well anyway, as you can't count on all of the posts for honest non biased feedback, there really have been many posts that offer you great oppinions on keeping up with your show. You yourselves would be at a loss for helpful commentary and suggestions if this site wasn't around. Your always more then welcome to start your own threads, on thoughts of your tv show. Let it be known though, some of the posts you participated in were asking for offensive feedback about yourself, but these posts should have been if anything put into another thread. You yourself carried on the arguements, so your no better then any of us. Like i said, take what you can get. You have plenty of great feedback. As I was told, it is better to keep the lines of communication open....And You guys could definately benefit from alot of the oppinions.

[Oki Drifter]

Originally posted by Ziptyed
Snowblind inadvertinly brought a great point. Do you think anyone who wears Von Dutch even know who the man was?I seriously doubt it. Von Dutch was a leader in the custom car scene in the 50's and 60's,did amazing paint jobs, and was one of the best pinstripers to date. My point is after fashion got a hold of the Von Dutch name, the actual legend behind the name has been forgotten by most.

wow....and i thought Von Dutch was just another clothing company like Fubu or Phat Farm....
Thanks for the telling me and others that didn't Von Dutch was a Car guy's name

[Ziptyed]

off topic , but hey tight corner where did you get those cefiro pics?

[Ripper]

and yea, feel free to borrow this pic.

[nissanguy_24]

Ghost of Duluth.. I can only wish i had your patience.. You are as skillful with words as you are with the FD. However my temper is too hot at the moment so dont expect many more replies from me on the subject of Lieberman.

[DriftGirl]

Well, I missed the show...I gotta get TIVO!!

But caught this mile long thread.

I just wanna say:
If you own a business, you dont run it off of 'Love' or for 'Love'. Sorry kiddies (no offence) but the world just doesnt work that way....would be nice, but this aint fantasy land.
EVERY (and I mean EVERY) company is in business to make a profit. From my Sponsors on down to the little shop on the corner.

Businesses put out a product and hope that people 'love' it enough to buy it.....WITH MONEY.

Most people here are too young to really understand the way the world works.......they will in time, but not now.

oh yeah, everyone here would love to have the position(s) that Craig has had over the years....How you would 'do things' is up to you, But you would love the chance to do it. Please dont lie and say you wouldnt.

[ACDSupra7]

Craig can I have some money?

[Ziptyed]

Obviously Mr. Lieberman no one likes your show, so you may now leave with your tail between your legs and what ever dignity you may have left. In the beggining we gave you feedback, very good feedback I might add, but you didn't listen. We told you repeatedly what we, the drifting public, wanted to see, yet you became cocky. You may have been flamed upon, but you brought it upon yourself. So since you've already ruined this show, you may like to try a euro lowrider forum, or possibly another "rice" forum, because thats the audience you're really trying to reach. Spare me your crap about "For drifters by drifters". we know you and your big money cronies are just trying to make a quick buck of the latest so called fad. But drifting is not a fad. Drifting will be around for a lot longer than your cheap *Censored**Censored**Censored* will. So take your "Tuner" propaganda and find people who care. Oh and by the way don't let the door hit you on the way out.

[spock]

brace for impact