Keep Drifting Fun! Is this Fun???

[YOitzJDM]

VGJ is the effing man!

Sounds like the pace cone wasn't used properly in this case, I would love to see the video.

The only reason why I keep saying Tyler's car has a problem is because it seems like your saying he had no good right to ask for the pace cone. Well yeah, if my car couldn't accelerate I would ask for it as well no matter what kind of engine I have. The question is, why did intec agree to it?

they didn't agree.

But it was on record that it was requested, and it seems as though the judges took that request as accepted.

[Bebop]

did they petition post race?

I would have been up at the judges tower going ape sh!t Bill Sherman style

[Piner]

^ lmao @ Bill comment

[Tyler McQuarrie]

Tyler McQ asked for a pace against Dean K, knowing that his car has DOUBLE the horsepower of Dean, and were within .3 mph on their entry speed according to the qualifying speeds (69.4 for T McQ, 69.7 for Dean K). Then, when Dean has a slight lead when initiating, he's penalized.

Petty and Tyler McQ both had problems following Takatori, Petty qualified 1 mph slower than Takatori, and Takatori was 1 mph slower than McQ. But remember, McQ asked for a pace from Dean K, maybe he didn't REALLY need that pace since he came in too hot?!

Eric O'Sullivan and Dai Yoshihara both spun out following Forsberg. Then Eric posts this video on Youtube which clearly shows Forsberg yanking the ebrake and changing his speed by roughly 5-10 mph instantly, forcing Eric to spin.

FD is becoming more and more about tactics, instead of drifting. The front and rear brakelights are a good idea, but if people are pulling the ebrake, it doesn't show up. Also, as the cars exited the bank, the judges couldn't see either front or rear brakelight from the stands.

FD needs to put a stop to this petty crap. Make the drivers drive!!!

YoitzJDM- I respect your opinon and see how you could come to this conclusion, but let me clear up a few things. I have never and will NEVER play games to get a win. You can ask any FD driver and I think they will tell you that I'm a pretty straight up dude. My car has had straight line issues dating back to last year. It has tons of side bite but lacks straight line grip. The more side bite you put into a car the more straight line speed you give up and since my car is lacking it, it shows even more.

We didn't even have a pace cone in NJ and I asked my team mate JR to pace me in at least first gear... and he still gapped me into the bank. The judges were very clear that they wanted to see the 2 cars together going into the bank, which is why they put the pace cone there. I went to Dean before and asked him for the pace. My mistake was thinking we would roll off together and I don't think he knew how slow my car was. The combination of the 2 made a very big gap. We were not side by side at the pace and I NEVER lifted to create a bigger gap... trust me, I was in full attack mode to catch up! If you read my blog at www.tylermcquarrie.com you will see that I thought it was going to be a OMT and even I was a little surprized that they gave me the win. I never want to win like that but the judges were very clear. I also asked Takatori for the pace and if you watch my video on Vimeo you will see that we stayed together until the pace. In fact watch any of my video's on there and you'll see that I struggle to get the power down.

I hate when drivers play games and I never want to see them in drifting. I never was a fan of the pace cone until I drove this car. Having 2 cars enter together does make for a better show and if the pace cane does that... well awesome.

Again, I respect your opinon but there were no games being played on my side!

[Bebop]

and it was said

[driftduck]

Oh mad Mike.... your wheels are too baller for drift....

[Bebop]

Word on the street is those wheels are actually pretty light!

[ontrack]

IMO there simply needs to be a decision made, either have the pace-cone for every Every Run of Every Round OR DON'T. FD just needs to make the decision one way or the other and everyone just deal with it. They seem to stick to other nonsense decisions without wavering so why is this any different?
Mike, thank you for giving professional clarification.
Tyler, you're an excellent driver with a good reputation.
Personally I can't figure FD out. They seem to change what they want to see for each round. Lead driver supposed to follow the line, hit the clipping points and zones and the chase driver is supposed to mirror the lead. But that's not how they seem to judge most of the time. It's as though their criteria changes for each pairing of drivers.
I love drifting and want to see it grow and evolve in the best way but without consistency from the Professional Organization that is unlikely to be any time soon.

[Bebop]

Personally I can't figure FD out. They seem to change what they want to see for each round. Lead driver supposed to follow the line, hit the clipping points and zones and the chase driver is supposed to mirror the lead. But that's not how they seem to judge most of the time. It's as though their criteria changes for each pairing of drivers.

Quoted for truff.

[driftduck]

Word on the street is those wheels are actually pretty light!

I believe it, they're just way too baller. Too much ballin going on inside those wheels.


I was curious though how such a low offset effects the handling of that car.

[Bebop]

I was curious though how such a low offset effects the handling of that car.

In the early days of drifting before rack and knuckle modifications, it was a good inexpensive method of increasing steering angle. But with the technology these days its not that crucial to have low offset... some teams just use it for the illusion of excess countersteer. Looks like your at full lock when you are really not.

My concern with Mikes car.... is that it might be too low.

Back on the subject, Dean posted his side of the story.

http://deankearney.com/formula-d-rd4-seattle-wa.html

It sounds like he knew there was suppose to be a pace cone, but he underestimated how slow Tyler was. Its a tough judgment to deal with, personally with what being said from both sides I would have given the win the Dean. Considering his car was better setup to "give a good show", he shouldn't be penalized that much by ill preparation of another team. Shoot Takas car was underpowered and still has a short wheel base and small patch of traction and he gets zero breaks in tandem.

[ASD Team]

Lots if interesting perspectives on here... but many conclusions seem to be made without knowing all of the relevant info. Understandable though, opinions can only be formed with the facts you have.

Tyler's car is slow off the line, I'm the first to admit it. It's set up for drifting, not drag racing. Thats because we're drifting... not drag racing.

You don't get something for nothing, and we sacrifice some straight line speed for having the car work even better while in drift at some tracks - dependent on if FD is using the pace cone. Its a compromised balance we go back and forth with at different tracks. I think nearly all our competitors in FD will agree that the car works very well in drift. If Tyler is unhappy with his car right now as was claimed by someone on here, its news to me. I think there might be a lot of FD drivers who would be very happy to drive a car as well as that car works

Personally I like the pace cone. I don't want to see JR or D-Mac have 4 car lengths on Taka's Corolla by the first turn. That would suck.

Tyler's car has huge horsepower, but isn't as fast as some cars - at some tracks - in a straight line before drifting starts. Once in drift, it'll run with anyone. So if a 300hp car can have a pace cone before drifting starts, why can't Tyler?

I'm sure some people will claim it should be able to do both exceptionally well. I guess that would mean those people know more about drift car suspension set-up than I do.
Thats always possible I suppose. If anyone thinks thats the case, please send me your resume and apply for the job

For the record, I think FD is doing a great job all around. Same thing again, its hard to draw very accurate conclusions without all of the information. I might disagree with some calls, but we live in a subjective world. Maybe I also don't have all the information on the occaisions when I disagree with some of the calls.

Ok, I'm bound to get flamed now

Ian.
ASD Inc.

[MonkeySlide]

Lots if interesting perspectives on here... but many conclusions seem to be made without knowing all of the relevant info. Understandable though, opinions can only be formed with the facts you have.

Tyler's car is slow off the line, I'm the first to admit it. It's set up for drifting, not drag racing. Thats because we're drifting... not drag racing.

You don't get something for nothing, and we sacrifice some straight line speed for having the car work even better while in drift at some tracks - dependent on if FD is using the pace cone. Its a compromised balance we go back and forth with at different tracks. I think nearly all our competitors in FD will agree that the car works very well in drift. If Tyler is unhappy with his car right now as was claimed by someone on here, its news to me. I think there might be a lot of FD drivers who would be very happy to drive a car as well as that car works

Personally I like the pace cone. I don't want to see JR or D-Mac have 4 car lengths on Taka's Corolla by the first turn. That would suck.

Tyler's car has huge horsepower, but isn't as fast as some cars - at some tracks - in a straight line before drifting starts. Once in drift, it'll run with anyone. So if a 300hp car can have a pace cone before drifting starts, why can't Tyler?

I'm sure some people will claim it should be able to do both exceptionally well. I guess that would mean those people know more about drift car suspension set-up than I do.
Thats always possible I suppose. If anyone thinks thats the case, please send me your resume and apply for the job

For the record, I think FD is doing a great job all around. Same thing again, its hard to draw very accurate conclusions without all of the information. I might disagree with some calls, but we live in a subjective world. Maybe I also don't have all the information on the occaisions when I disagree with some of the calls.

Ok, I'm bound to get flamed now

Ian.
ASD Inc.

You will not be flamed by me good sir. I think it is great every time a driver or a team member actually chimes in on these issues so that things to get out of hand. For the record I agree with you on the pace cone 100%.

We already know that some cars on the FD grid are going to be faster than others in a straight line. I hate the feeling of already knowing there is going to be a huge gap in a tandem battle because one car is so much more powerful than the other. I think that is partly what started the "horsepower wars" in FD in the first place and why we had the invasion of the V8s

I think the pace cone is a great way to make sure the battle stays sideways and not one car trying to beat the other to the initation point.

I will say it is pretty trippy to me that Tyler's car is "slow". Its times like this when I wish I was a suspension guy so I would know how exactly to set up a car in such a way.

I know you can't actually talk about it but I would love to know how you increased "in-drift" performance by taking away straight line speed with only suspension work.

[Slapshotnerd]

Ian,

Glad you came on here to post your $.02. I'm no suspension guru, in fact it's quite the rocket science to me.

It seems to be that part of the "fun" of Drifting is finding that balance between straight line speed and sideways maneuverability. The cars that are the fastest in the straight line often are slow once they get sideways, and vice versa. Sounds like Tyler's car is one of those cars that does better when it's sideways. If that's the case, wouldn't the pace cone make drifting less competitive?

If someone knows that they can just ask for a pace cone, and negate a 10-15 mph difference coming off the line because their suspension is dialed in for sideways sliding, wouldn't everyone just dial their car in for sideways driving and ask for the pace every time? What good is 700hp if you can't get it down to the ground to take off the line?

What if we took the pace cone out of the scenario? Would ASD then dial in Tyler's car to have more straight line grip to try and keep up with the cars that were faster off the line? wouldn't that lead to better drifting? Let everyone try and find that balance between straight line grip and sideways maneuverability, and they can pick and choose which setup they want. It sounds like entry speeds (and thus exit speeds) would be faster if we forced everyone to try and keep up.

I find it hard to understand why we should give the team that has 700hp and a high-dollar build an advantage because they CHOSE to take away straight line grip, when the team they are competing with probably has built their entire car for the less than the cost of the motor in Tyler's car. Pushing 450 or 500 HP out of an SR20 reliably is much harder to do compared to pushing out 700 hp out of a V8 that's nearly 3.5 times the displacement, and if they are able to create that 4-5 car gap off the straight away, then so be it. You admit that if you WANTED to give Tyler more straight line grip, you could. On a track like Evergreen that often sees 100+mph wheel speeds before initiation, shouldn't we showcase all of that speed?

So again, it seems that we have come back to the original question..... why should a car with twice the horsepower be given a pace cone because of the way their suspension is dialed in?

[Bebop]

AEM: 350Z and Scion TC*barf*

Both rockets off the line and in drift.

I would like the to see a set of rules from formula D that are the same every round every battle. Pace cone or not, just something definite to go by.