WORLD DRIFT CHAMPIONSHIPS (WDC) vs. FORMULA DRIFT (FD)

[kidynomite]

Originally posted by motdyn_s14

FD vs WDC is a disaster as the above posts have pointed out already. What they are doing is diluting the talents and the teams at this nurturing stage of drifting. And I wonder if it is coincident or accident that there are 4 out of 10 WDC events conflicting with FD events. How about FD round 5 in Chicago and WDC round 8 in Chicago/Milwaukee?! They got to do something about it.

Ya thats not cool at all, 2 events in my area on the same day. As of now it seems most of the Chicago area guys will be going to FD just because we know more about it. But then again I see no rule book for either place, and I don't have time and money to be waiting forever.

[Toycoma]

Originally posted by kidynomite
Ya thats not cool at all, 2 events in my area on the same day. As of now it seems most of the Chicago area guys will be going to FD just because we know more about it. But then again I see no rule book for either place, and I don't have time and money to be waiting forever.

well this is what you do by this point from a driver or teams point of view if you have been going to both events up until now. you pick the event in which you will either A: have a better chance at winning or B: help put you in the points lead over all because certain drivers wont be there.

[Ris4drift]

afaik both neither have a non-tentative schedule,and neither has a rulebook out.

[Octagon]

First off, James I'm curious as to why Formula Drift would disallow your car/truck/thingy, (as El Caminos are so frequntly referred to). The HellCamino has become a visible fan favorite car in Formula Drift. Unless there was a serious safety issue with the car/truck/thingy due to either the age or construction of the chassis, there's no sound competitive or business reason to disallow it.

Now, onto the WDC v FD situation.

Really, it's far FAR too soon into drifting for there to be two pro series. Honestly, the more involved I become in the "infrastructure" of the sport, the more I believe maybe it's too soon for one ESPECIALLY when the one is doing so much in its power to garner publicity and not much else.

I agree that the grassroots base is shaky and poorly supported. There is also very little emphasis on the "motorsports" end of drifting. It's being blown up as a cult of personality and fabulous entertainment, but no attempt has been made to garner a regular fanbase of paying enthusiasts who will support the series in its endeavors.

Formula Drift I honestly believe will continue to grow and will be strong. I also believe that the SCCA and the domestic manufacturers interest and influence will prop FD up should things become difficult. However, it's also clear to me that FD needs a bankrolling title sponsor that can put up a good minimum purse and it needs to be a little bit less "youth culture focused".

Face it folks, young people en mass have very little income, and even less disposable income. They're also fickle to trends, difficult to predict, and generally do not become dedicated to a single hobby/trend/interest especially expensive ones. One of the biggest reasons NASCAR has grown to its present size is by being "family friendly".

Think about it. Teenage Joe goes to Formula Drift event. He brings his own drink (if they let him or if he can sneak it past the guards), eats off the dollar menu at the closest McDonalds, maybe buys a t-shirt, and will buy the cheapest seat he can see from.

However, Ma and Pa take little Billy and Suzie to a NASCAR event. Pa buys a hat for Ma to keep the sun out of their eyes, and of course Suzie wants a shirt and Billy wants that diecast car of his favorite driver. There's sodas, hot dogs, and snacks bought at the track for the family, and Pa rents a scanner so he can listen in on all the radio transmissions and "get in on the action". During the race, Billy and Suzie get a little bored, so Pa gives them quarters to play in the on-site arcade, or lets them go see demonstrations and such at the Manufacturer's Midway. Afterwards, Pa had to get pit passes so that Billy could get his diecast signed.

That's how NASCAR makes its money. Same with Indy, USAC, NHRA, or any of the other major motorsports groups in America. You can't be "edgy", "hip", and "youth culture" and attract the big bucks of middle America. It doesn't happen, won't happen, and will be the biggest hindrance to Formula Drift until they realize it.

[Ris4drift]

Originally posted by Octagon
First off, James I'm curious as to why Formula Drift would disallow your car/truck/thingy, (as El Caminos are so frequntly referred to). The HellCamino has become a visible fan favorite car in Formula Drift. Unless there was a serious safety issue with the car/truck/thingy due to either the age or construction of the chassis, there's no sound competitive or business reason to disallow it..

We have been told the El Camino will be allowed back to the series no problem whatsoever, our 2nd vehicle all i will say is the wheelbase/overal length is shorter, will wiegh less than a stock Nissan 350Z, and has a unibody. Thats as far as i will go not to let teh cat out of the bag. But FD has told us no go on it, WDC has said okay. I personaly am extremely biased towards FD as my #1,2,...87, 87.5 option as of right now. But I mean we gotta do what we gotta do. I just want to drift..

anwyays back to topic.

[kidynomite]

Originally posted by Toycoma
well this is what you do by this point from a driver or teams point of view if you have been going to both events up until now. you pick the event in which you will either A: have a better chance at winning or B: help put you in the points lead over all because certain drivers wont be there.

Here is the problem, the amount of people that will be participating in one of these events (other than pros) is very limited. I could name off all of them, and some of them are still a toss up b/c there is no rule books.

Both of these groups are looking to host something rediculously big (especially hard drive) which is going to cost a lot of money, one of them is going to be empty and lose out on a lot of money. And FD has a name already, HD just seems like another car show and we have plenty in Chicago.

[SHIFT_KING]

Formula D is at the top of the food chain, but that doesnt mean they are owed that position. They will have to fight to give the spectators the best show and the drivers / teams the most support.

I gotta fight and prove that im the best person for my job every day.

As far as I can see, WDC is puttin they money where there mouth is. FD better step up to the plate as well.

They wanna be the heavy weight champs but dont wanna defend the title? *Censored**Censored**Censored**Censored* that! May the best series win.

[Ghost of Duluth]

I'll support Formula D. I see no reason to feed WDC any steam. Their tactics are shady, judging is ludicrous and it's just a shameless stab at a blossoming sport whose best ally right now is time. The entire sport is too virgin to be hosting a hostile takeover of the main series. Too bad the fat cats up in the Primedia compound will realize this too late.

But there could be a snag. With a corperation as large as Primedia, a series could succeed just by throwing money at it. If they dump enough money into it, it could surpass Formula D. Depends on how much they want to lose. As for the Pros, if you don't throw in they might just make their own pro's. Sounds goofy but once again, money talks. So in all reality it is up to the fans to make or break WDC. If no one goes, it will eventually fail because sooner or later the higher ups will see that there are low or no ticket sales and either adjust their strategies or just close up shop. Let's hope they cut their losses before dragging this thing out with the money tossing described above. Unfortunatly real Drift fans don't make up the majority so it will boil down to whose the flashiest and who grabs the attention of the "Import lifestyler" the most. Because it sounds to me thats what WDC is banking on. "Bigger and better" is what they said.

The sad truth of it all is that Drifting is so new that it can be made or broken at this juncture. As Pro's you guys are in the worst possible spot because it is such a shakey spot. One day you can be on top and the next day busted. Add the unpredictability of the sport, it's sponsers and fans to most of you guys inability to keep a full time job due to event obligations and you have some very poor people sitting at the top of a shakey tower. There is alot of money floating around in the sport but it seems to miss all of you. This is a problem that needs to be addressed by you, your team managers and Formula D. Transport seems to be a major concern on alot of peoples minds. Transport and lodging. These are 2 (but not all) of the largest expenditures besides the car if you are not supplied one. These need to be taken under discussion.

One way to bring this under control is a unified Drivers association. I'm sure this is being taken care of in some way, shape or form but it needs to be made public so the they know about it. Right now you guys are too spread out. Companies can shaft you on things and others can use your names without you knowing because the entire sport relies on word of mouth basically except for the web to hear about things. You all need to form up and basically make stuff run through you. This is not done without risk. Sometimes people don't like unity. Someone has to head this Drivers association as well. Someone who is well spoken, dresses sharp and knows about negotiating and what not. If you want to hunt a pack of wolves, you don't do it with a rabbit, you send in a wolf yourself.

You guys need to hit the regional, local or practice days and just have fun again. There are plenty of grassroots events going on in all parts of the country now that you guys can go to these and instruct. Also an instructer gets paid or at least they damm well should. I would gladly pay a fee for some pro level instruction. You guys have to eat just like everyone else does. The main problem is time and money for you. Maybe the money can be alliviated at least a little by the instruction and the time can be eased by more spread out events and sponser assisted travel.

In closing it's high time something needs to be done and adding another Drifting series is not it.

[c.wan]

Both WDC & FD is currently trying to be the top tier series in the U.S. They are both promoting to the public, media, drivers, sponsors, etc. that they have all the top drivers & teams running in their series, including top japanese drivers.

It's great that we get to compete & excel our skill by driving with pro japanese drivers, but my concern is this: THE SPLIT IS ALREADY HAPPENING. The season is about to start, and there are US drivers who have intentions of competing in one series over the other, splitting up the "top" drivers we had in FD last year. And now there are Japanese drivers wanting to compete in the US that are going to be in both series as well.

Even if all of the current "top" US drivers compete only in FD, WDC will still have drivers in their series and those drivers will become new "top" US drivers in that series. The international drivers and Japan drivers competing in either series will draw attention to the series that they are running in. So either series can still be top tier.

2004 for FD was a great year, we've all worked hard to get to where we are today, building up spectator awareness, driver profiles, sponsors, and drifting as a legitimate sport. The new season is about to start, and 2005 is gonna be a whole new game.

Will WDC or FD be the top tier series? I don't know... ONLY TIME WILL TELL. My only concern is that we're already being split up and pulled in both directions...

We as a whole need to make sure, somehow, the true sport of drifting survives... with just ONE top tier series.

Calvin Wan

[SHIFT_KING]

Again I gotta say that FD needs to fight to keep the top spot. WDC is making a move to be number one and this is the PERFECT time to do it.

I see claims people are making that WDC is only in it for the money. Grow up kiddo's EVERY company is in it for the money and will fight to be on top and anyone who thinks different is a fool.


Oh, People sound like idots saying that one company should strive to be #2 and all these /SPONSORED PRO's talkin bout what series they'll run in,etc. You guys will run whatever series your Sponsor see's fit for their company or you'll be sittin next to me in the stands There must be sumthin tempting about the other series or else you guys wouldnt feel pulled in 2 directions.

[z28evans]

f.y.i. - the guys running the WDC were in FD last year and are not new to drifting.

We are still trying to get sponsors, as it sits at this moment (assuming all of our deals in the works fall through) we will be going into debt to race in either series, money is a big concern and we will run where we can.

That being said, we still don't know which series to run.

One other thing for you whiner's - having two series to choose from is a good thing, means the sport is growing. More events at more locations. What if we didn't have ANY series to run next year

james

[Toycoma]

Originally posted by z28evans

One other thing for you whiner's - having two series to choose from is a good thing, means the sport is growing. More events at more locations. What if we didn't have ANY series to run next year

james

true drift enthusiests wouldnt care. and actually, i dont see how "pro" series benifits any of us "grass roots" drivers. and besides, how many of the pro drivers are making real money from their driving? like atleast 50,000 a year just for driving the car.

[SHIFT_KING]

Originally posted by Toycoma
true drift enthusiests wouldnt care. and actually, i dont see how "pro" series benifits any of us "grass roots" drivers. and besides, how many of the pro drivers are making real money from their driving? like atleast 50,000 a year just for driving the car.

True Drift Enthusiasts will care cause it means more events we'll be able to be IN. & 50k aint that much cash dude

z28evans-Id suggest running in the series that shows the most support to the drivers. if that means prize money, housing allowance,transportation or whatever.

[Toycoma]

Originally posted by SHIFT_KING
True Drift Enthusiasts will care cause it means more events we'll be able to be IN. & 50k aint that much cash dude

50k is more then probably what any of the top ten finishers in FD made last year for driving. Ask any of them if they made money by driving. Last i heard guys like Tony and Chris and who ever else, had jobs out side of drifting to pay for their living and things of that nature. What really needs to happend before there are more then one drift series is drift league of some sort. Like a NDL (National Drifters League) or something. a place where track owners, promotors and the drivers can all get together once or twice a year and go over everything and that will make drifting stronger. not this IHRA vs NHRA IRL vs CHAMP bull that keeps happening. If you are a true fan of the "sport" you want to know who is the best in this country and to do that, you need one series with all drivers in it. Not two series with some drivers in one and some in the other. in the end it doesnt work.

[CRASHDRIVE]

Wait a minute...
Aren't all of you people said that "In order for drifting to grow in the US, we need more events such as FD"?

Are you guys serious? Now that "Drifting" is growing, you guys are saying that "it's growing too fast" I mean you guys are the one that shove the "street" drifters off. Saying that FD will be a good thing for all drifters. Us "amatuer or street drifters" only wanted; are well established/more events (or even cheaper) for us little guys so we can excel to our ability. Now that their is another series that's starting to compete with FD you guys are saying that "there should only be one pro series". If you look at the archived threads here, there's a argument between FD and any other drifters (i think the title was "American drifting; going the wrong way?) i'm not trying to repeat the past but atleast be consistent to your statements.

This was what we were saying that "drifting is growing too fast and there is not enough talent to fill the events" If there was more/cheaper events to go; the talents will emerge and get discovered.

This is my .02 cents; Say whatever you want about me; I don't care. I love driving; I love practicing drifting. When I can afford it; I go to track events; (which is pretty often).

"I Told you so" is not even worth it anymore.

Oh before you all say that "what have you done to the drifting community or other cr@p like that" I've been practicing in Gymkhana events. I'm not very good but that's just because my car is not fully tuned yet.
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