2009 DRIFT DODGE CHALLENGER By MOPAR

[MonkeySlide]

I can clearly see why it is LEGAL.
the actual "tub" of the car or whatever you might want to call it, seems to be normal. The sports where the suspension bolts to seems to be normal, however, the rest of the car is a Nascar/monster truck/jungle gym/ tube fest/ etc.

Seems pretty clear that the rules were clearly understood and taken to the extreme.

Do I like it? hell no.
Will it be legal? sadly yes.
Is it a car anymore? no way.

What's your problem with it? I'm seriously asking here

Do you just not like it when a big budget team actually uses their budget to build something beyond what the smaller budget teams can build?

Do you think they've gone too far?

Or do you just hate the way it looks?

I know you dont hate american cars so thats not it.

[Brian]

many many reasons.

here are a few,

1. I came from a time when people built up little cars and drifted them. I did not jump into it when it started gaining popularity and big name race drivers came in with high dollar budgets. Sorry, just not a fan of that.

2. I really don't feel that this IS a car anymore. It is a tub and a cage built on it. Then, body panels are attached to it to make it a "car".

3. I do (for the most part) hate american cars.

4. I 100% hate the way it looks. I hate the viper too. I can't even tell what the graphic scheme is. What is going on?

5. I think this has gone WAY too far, and that is an understatement.

6. Again, I'll compare it to the SA 34. I just cannot force my mind to compare the two cars and then say, OKAY the skyline is illegal. They put Laurel coilovers on it. This Challenger is totally okay though. The coilovers will start at the same place...



***ALSO PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE YOU CRUCIFY ME***


This car has a HELL OF A LOT of work/time/skill put into it. I am in no way downplaying that. This thing is a planned out crazy machine. GREAT job on building it.

I just do not feel that it is a car anymore.


Sort of makes me feel like a NASCAR camry is going to race a CAMRY I just bought from Toyota... oh.. yeah, they are the same. sure sure. yes indeed.

[Brian]

It reminds me also of when Rhys brought a full rally car Evo... 6, I think to the RS*R event YEARS ago.
Here are a bunch of drift cars. Typical drift cars... then

ummmm, why is there a full blown Race car here?




On the topic of race cars, Let's take for example, HKS D1 S15 that they had. They killed it in that car, but guess what, it was still a car.


They didn't come in and build a JGTC car and then call it a drift car.

[Brian]

how about another more recent one.

DO you remember when FD first had the demo at Long Beach?
Taniguchi brought that 161. When I saw it, it was stickerless, but stil la full blown, purpose built drift car.
It WAS STILL A CAR. It looked like a car.
It had an awesome cage and a wild interior full of meters and dials and carbon.

Was it a cage built on a Toyota floorpan? No.
Did he absolutley KILL IT at that demo? Hell yes.


Maybe it is just a HUGE difference between building USA drift cars and building Japan drift cars.

[deadpirate]

i cannot agree with brian more


and i even came into the game way late.

many many reasons.

here are a few,

1. I came from a time when people built up little cars and drifted them. I did not jump into it when it started gaining popularity and big name race drivers came in with high dollar budgets. Sorry, just not a fan of that.

2. I really don't feel that this IS a car anymore. It is a tub and a cage built on it. Then, body panels are attached to it to make it a "car".

3. I do (for the most part) hate american cars.

4. I 100% hate the way it looks. I hate the viper too. I can't even tell what the graphic scheme is. What is going on?

5. I think this has gone WAY too far, and that is an understatement.

6. Again, I'll compare it to the SA 34. I just cannot force my mind to compare the two cars and then say, OKAY the skyline is illegal. They put Laurel coilovers on it. This Challenger is totally okay though. The coilovers will start at the same place...



***ALSO PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE YOU CRUCIFY ME***


This car has a HELL OF A LOT of work/time/skill put into it. I am in no way downplaying that. This thing is a planned out crazy machine. GREAT job on building it.

I just do not feel that it is a car anymore.


Sort of makes me feel like a NASCAR camry is going to race a CAMRY I just bought from Toyota... oh.. yeah, they are the same. sure sure. yes indeed.

[MonkeySlide]

Let me ask you to consider a few things.

I also came from the time when people built whatever car they could get and drifted them.

And despite what's going on in the hub-bub of Formula D the time from before still exists. There are still grassroots events with people who just have regular cars that they spent their money on and go drift. I don't feel whats going on in Formula D right now takes away from that.

This is just the way that all growing motorsports go. The money gets bigger so the tech gets more extensive and things progress.

The awesome thing about drifting is that the guys who like to drift with a "car" can still go out and take a shot at the bigger fish. At the very least there is still a clearly defined path for someone to go to grassroots to pro. Its hard as all hell but its there and I'd say probably a lot easier when compaired to other motorsports.

Second thing...what is a "car" really? Is it just a frame, four wheels, an engine, and a seat? Does it start at the bare chassis? Is it not a car until it has fenders? I guess everyone's definition is different.

Although to go back to your examples..I wouldn't really say that what Mopar built would be good for anything else but drifting. I dont see it as a "race car" that they're trying to pass off as a drift car. I just see it as a drift car that was BUILT like a race car in the sense that its 100% dedicated for one fuction.

Its not like what you and I were used to back in the day when people would take a regular car and build a drift car around that...or try to turn it INTO a drift car.

Also...despite whats going on with Mopar and RMR and other bigger teams. I do think Formula D does have a "limit" to how far someone can go. I dont think they'd let someone have some sort of clear cut advantage over anyone else.

Anyone remember back in the day when Rhys' GTO had the infamous "anti-spin spoiler"? Even though it didn't really look to help him all that much...Formula D wasn't about to wait and see if it did and took care of it ASAP.

Slightly off topic but the other question I want to ask you and anyone who might share your opinion is...what's so wrong with "big budget" teams? Why does that have such a negative connotation these days?

I mean...no matter who they are AEM, Mopar, GM, RMR...at some point all of those companies and everyone who drives for those companies had to work hard to get to where they are.

With the exception of Rhys..Sam nor Tanner were really world famous before this. They worked to get themselves attention just like any other grassroots guy out there who is looking to turn pro.

I mean heck...Sam is pretty much the American dream personified...accent and all. He didn't have all that much when he got here but now look at him.

What makes those teams/companies so bad?

On the issue of the SA car. Changing the suspension wasn't really illegal...I think the issue there is that Formula D felt that they changed it without properly informing them of it. Nuformz learned from that and had 7 dudes inspect the car to make sure there was no confusion.

Anyway like I said before I get where you're coming from...I'm just saying maybe be a little bit more open minded about this kind of thing...big companies spending a lot of money to have a strong showing in a sport that is important to us...is a part of what keeps things going.

Mopar and RMR building those crazy cars made EVERYONE else step their game up and I mean everyone...down to the guys who still rock corolla's.

There are always going to be big budget teams and there are always going to be priveteer underdogs. The cool thing about drifting is that on a good day..no matter what they're all on a level playing field.

That's also one of the good things about drifting being subjective. Just because one car is way faster and better built than the low power car doesn't automatically give it the win...the judges take into account the difference in cars before they make their decision. Despite what it looks like...there is always a real chance for anyone.

All in all I think thats a good thing.

[Brian]

What is your background with drifting?


I have a few groups that I can "classify" people into, as far as drifting is concerned.


I'd like to see which one you fit into.

[Slapshotnerd]

I'd like to see more drift teams take their cars to other events. Time attack, drag, autocross, road race, whatever. I think many of these cars would do very good at other events as well.

[Justin Banner]

Hey there are a lot of tubes...but I see a uni-body in there...somewhere...its just super re-enforced.

Typically, from my training as an auto tech, a uni-body incorporated the roof into the structure.

I don't see that in this build, but I'm not questioning it's legality, just suggesting that it's no longer a uni-body car.

[MonkeySlide]

Typically, from my training as an auto tech, a uni-body incorporated the roof into the structure.

I don't see that in this build, but I'm not questioning it's legality, just suggesting that it's no longer a uni-body car.

LoL duh..they do have a roof dont they..my bad! Yeah then you're right its like..half a uni-body and then a bunch of tubes.

Brian...I'm not really sure what "group" I'd fit into..I'm not much for labels...I'm just an enthusiast whos been interested in drifting before I knew what drifting was.

I found out about it the same way most people did..reading option mag and watching option videos back in 98-99.

[mlmsilvias14]

I think what Brian is trying to say about being dissapointed in big budget teams is this; THE CARS LACK PERSONALITY!
Back when I first got into drifting and the reason why lots of people related to it then, was because of the personal flavor each driver added to his car. Big budget teams completely have forgotten this key element, keeping the fans attached and excited.
Even HKS, as heavily built as their carsare, still keep Taniguchi's style in many ways. Same with many of the teams and drivers in D1.
I find it far more exciting watching someone drift that thoughly loves the car they drive and show that love and expression with their own individual style.

[TyCooley]

this car is just a move to the future. With TV coverage and so much magazine coverage people are getting bigger budgets to go drifting. This is normal in any automotive sport that is in its' infancy. Sport Compact Drag Racing and Time Attack. Drag Raceing used to be a bunch of street turbo charged cars and when you would go to the track you put slicks on your car. Now (few years later) you have fwd drag cars that are full tube chassis, full carbon fiber bodies, $40,000 transmissions and make 1500hp out of a 4cly and have to change engine between rounds like a top fuel car. Time Attack cars are getting ridiculous also. If givin the budget and opportunity would you turn your drift car into a crazy machine and do everything top notch? I dare you to tell me you wouldn't

This is a professional series, you should expect this. FD created the rules and have complete control on where they want this sport to go.

[Bebop]

I think drifting needs a street class lol

Seriously, WRC cars arent even this "built"

FD needs to do something with the company before it turns into monster jam.

[J.Herron]

FD Street legal is one of the best ideas I've heard so far.

[Brian]

If givin the budget and opportunity would you turn your drift car into a crazy machine and do everything top notch? I dare you to tell me you wouldn't

This is a professional series, you should expect this. FD created the rules and have complete control on where they want this sport to go.

I can tell you with complete confidence that I would NOT turn my drift car into anything like this Dodge car. I could have an unlimited budget.... wouldn't matter.

I DO and DID expect this, just so you know. I mentioned earlier that I feel there are GROUPS of people that are "into" drifting.
YOU seem to be in the group that comes into drifting late. Sees potential in WINNING and making it something totally SERIOUS and business related. You didn't start with the beginning. You want to know the other guys in the same group as you? Rhys, Tanner, Sam H.

I realize that more and more money will be dumped into the sport until the the guys with the pocketbooks realize they aren't making any money off of it. Then, because it is BUSINESS NOW, they are just going to drop it and it will die out. I think it is a pretty simple concept.

I like (to an extent) where drifting has gone. I like being able to see it in the streets of my hometown. That is cool. The redbull thing is going to be awesome. again, I have to state this so people don't get the idea that I HATE everything about drifting now. I understand there are a lot of people who quickly jump to conclusions without reading everything. ****

I'll have more words later.