Formula D Sonoma (FEEDBACK)

[nissanguy_24]

I just want to see Formula D evolve into a stable honorable and cool series. But im also the kind of guy who believes it doesnt need to be a rich boy club to do it. Skill will keep the ranks thin, not money. At least thats how i wish to see it. And indeed i want to see that for drifting as a whole.

But in order for that to happen they need to have strict rules about whos paid what. judges i mean. And indeed strict rules about what can run ect.

[NFJohn]

Have you ever gone up to Tarzan and confronted him with this. when I see him in a couple of weeks, I will pass on your concerns to him and his ability to keep his judgements honest true to the sport. I'm an American who is new to the drift scene, but from what I know, even though he may be from a younger generation, I would think Honor is something that is very important to Tarzan. And also to his employer, Team Taisan. I would venture to say, that if Ricky Chiba felt that his driver was not being truthful in his judgements, I would bet he would say something to him. Chiba carry's a lot of weight. But I will pass on your concerns to him.

[pony]

Originally posted by nissanguy_24
I just want to see Formula D evolve into a stable honorable and cool series. But im also the kind of guy who believes it doesnt need to be a rich boy club to do it. Skill will keep the ranks thin, not money. At least thats how i wish to see it. And indeed i want to see that for drifting as a whole.

But in order for that to happen they need to have strict rules about whos paid what. judges i mean. And indeed strict rules about what can run ect.

its definately not a rich boy club. most of the pro drifters have regular jobs like anyone else.

[AlexPfeiffer]

I understand the fans payed money to see a good show and a good demo. Give it to them, that is what the "Demo" runs with the "japanese pros" are for, the show part of it. Make them run more, they have free tires, sponcers, and are getting "payed" to be there.

You also have to understand that us as teams and drivers have spent thousands of dollars to "compete" in formula D and when it comes to it, thats what it should be, a true competition and not a demo. Right now, for a majority of us running in formula d, it feels more like a demo than a competition. Expecially with all the rules being broken and messed up. It will still be a good show if the competition was run correctly.

Tarzan. To me its nothing to do with mopar. He is one of the reasons why fans come out. The reason why i dont like him as a judge is because he is more worried about putting on a good show then actually making a competition. (i did sit in on the judge's meeting and all he is worried about is the show). Also notice he is the biggest figure on the web site and flyers? He does have the most influence on the judging.

The way he judges goes more basted off of the show you put on and not as much on the technical side of the driving. I know for a fact Dai had the best speed and started his drift earlier then 95% of us there but he didnt get high points going for top 16, rather the viper with a slower more tire smokey entry got highest marks. Its hard to explain, but alot of us drivers know there is something wrong.

Entry speed, angle, and apex are the most important things, but for some reason people with more tire smoke get points? Thats just not right.

[nissanguy_24]

Originally posted by pony
its definately not a rich boy club. most of the pro drifters have regular jobs like anyone else.

Im talking about the future. What do you think racing series with megadollar corporate sponsors turn into?

Why do you think in nascar so many of the drivers are related to other past drivers? god only knows how many Juniors there are in it. It has to do with the difficulty of getting into that "club" of racers. There are many racing series like that. The average joe working his way up has next to no chance compared to someone who was born into a rich family, or someone whos dad is a rich race car driver.


And Pfeiffer i have to say i pretty much agree with you on the smoke thing, i usualy cringe when i hear "drifting is based on speed, angle line, and most of all smoke!" or something similar... maybe for a demonstration or a show smoke is great but i prefer i guess the more racing side of it. The guy who shows he can control the car better and move faster and quicker then the rest.

anyways its really up to you drivers to get the word out and such. Hell i cant say anything with out it being taken as a personal insult it seems.

[DONKEY_WEAR]

maybe another problem with ross is that he never drove the car b4 sat was his first time driving it.....and he only got like 8 or 9 practice rounds in sooo that maybe a problem but its ok today he got a gang of practice

[Vosko]

i agree with the complaints about judging but the smoke thing goes with the entertaining the crowd. when i drive i love tons of smoke

[pony]

Originally posted by nissanguy_24
Im talking about the future. What do you think racing series with megadollar corporate sponsors turn into?

Why do you think in nascar so many of the drivers are related to other past drivers? god only knows how many Juniors there are in it. It has to do with the difficulty of getting into that "club" of racers. There are many racing series like that. The average joe working his way up has next to no chance compared to someone who was born into a rich family, or someone whos dad is a rich race car driver.


And Pfeiffer i have to say i pretty much agree with you on the smoke thing, i usualy cringe when i hear "drifting is based on speed, angle line, and most of all smoke!" or something similar... maybe for a demonstration or a show smoke is great but i prefer i guess the more racing side of it. The guy who shows he can control the car better and move faster and quicker then the rest.

anyways its really up to you drivers to get the word out and such. Hell i cant say anything with out it being taken as a personal insult it seems.

Thats how any motorsport ends up. You just gotta work harder and make those bucks and start competing. if not, NETWORK NETWORK NETWORK. makes some friends in the industry and get yourself sponsored.

its true, alot of NASCAR drivers are legacies, but more of them dont have NASCAR in their families.

[pony]

Originally posted by AlexPfeiffer
I understand the fans payed money to see a good show and a good demo. Give it to them, that is what the "Demo" runs with the "japanese pros" are for, the show part of it. Make them run more, they have free tires, sponcers, and are getting "payed" to be there.

You also have to understand that us as teams and drivers have spent thousands of dollars to "compete" in formula D and when it comes to it, thats what it should be, a true competition and not a demo. Right now, for a majority of us running in formula d, it feels more like a demo than a competition. Expecially with all the rules being broken and messed up. It will still be a good show if the competition was run correctly.

Tarzan. To me its nothing to do with mopar. He is one of the reasons why fans come out. The reason why i dont like him as a judge is because he is more worried about putting on a good show then actually making a competition. (i did sit in on the judge's meeting and all he is worried about is the show). Also notice he is the biggest figure on the web site and flyers? He does have the most influence on the judging.

The way he judges goes more basted off of the show you put on and not as much on the technical side of the driving. I know for a fact Dai had the best speed and started his drift earlier then 95% of us there but he didnt get high points going for top 16, rather the viper with a slower more tire smokey entry got highest marks. Its hard to explain, but alot of us drivers know there is something wrong.

Entry speed, angle, and apex are the most important things, but for some reason people with more tire smoke get points? Thats just not right.

i sent you a PM, yo.

[cartunes13]

Originally posted by Vosko
i agree with the complaints about judging but the smoke thing goes with the entertaining the crowd. when i drive i love tons of smoke

Trust me if/when you are concentrating driving (following the line or someone) you dont have time to notice your tire smoke. You see it lingering in the air after your run if it is not to windy.

[z28evans]

I'VE GOT IT!

Let's have all of the cars meet strict requirements so the cars are fair and equal. Then we will make speed and apex's the most important - and to insure unbiased opinions and make sure crowd entertainment doesn't influence anything (heaven forbid the spectators enjoy it too much), we will use timers instead of judges!

...oh, wait - then we will be like all the rest of motorsports

[my 1 88 u]

How about the series be ran by judges that are respected and honored so the spectators can just sit back and trust their decisions.

[craiglieberman]

Interesting debates...

I've been monitoring this only because I'm curious about whether the Japanese judges show bias to Japanese drivers or if American drivers/cars are well received within the community.

While debates about others issues rage, such as the perceived value of corporate sponsorships, I'd like to relate one little tidbit:

In every other form of motorsports, like cars are grouped together. Its' clear that the Viper is a purpose built race car as evidenced by its' participation in grip racing.

It would seem obvious to this casual observer that Sam' immense talent aside, the car seems to have an advantage over its' lower dollar rivals.

Who do you "blame"? The sanctioning body for allowing it to happen IF and ONLY IF the masses agree that is indeed an UNFAIR advantage.

My PERSONAL opinion is that right now, the sport feeds on the fans' feedback, mostly at the events. Therefore, it seems logical that anything that adds controversy draws fans...and builds crowds...and attracts sponsors, and new drivers and so on.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

[cartunes13]

As far as sponsors go, I feel they are needed. Just like the El Camino crew there is no way we would have made it out there with out them. I work a 9-5. I don’t get paid by my sponsor to drive the car. Up until I had a Dunlop as a tire sponsor, I was paying for the tires. Our agreement was I supplied the tires he supplied the car. I paid for the hotel and half the gas to and from California. If I had to buy tires, there would have been no way to make it. Dunlop sent over 1700.00 worth of tires. In the last 2 events (past 2 months) I have dumped more than 2,000 dollars of my own money to make it to the events. I have not even made top 16!! Should there be a limit to corporate sponsorship? I agree that there should be no alcohol sponsors. I don’t think we need any cigarette sponsors either. Further more sponsors only give product, not money to make it to the events. I do it because I have a passion for drifting. Hell I am 31 years old and I still play GT3 almost every day to drift lol. It’s all about Trial Mountain.
BTW The grass roots level is fun. After awhile you yearn for more though. Competing in FD this year has increased my skill level more than it would have just staying n Texas. I thought I had skill till I came to the big show. Being one the top 5 drifters in Texas doesn’t mean Jack in the pro series. I am sure Derrick from the El Camino crew will agree with this.
As far as the Mopar stuff goes, I feel the car shouldn’t be in next year. This year is already over so there is no sense in complaining about it anymore. I feel he is primed to take all 4 events. They allowed the car and he performs damn near flawless in it. My biggest complaint was what was said in the Lateral G interview. “…Lateral G Racing is fortunate because I believe that some other teams that drift on a professional level have spent close to $130,000 or even more on their cars to get to the level of competition that they are right now…” I don’t think so

[BensonHsu]

Re: Interesting debates...

Originally posted by craiglieberman
Who do you "blame"? The sanctioning body for allowing it to happen IF and ONLY IF the masses agree that is indeed an UNFAIR advantage.

My PERSONAL opinion is that right now, the sport feeds on the fans' feedback, mostly at the events. Therefore, it seems logical that anything that adds controversy draws fans...and builds crowds...and attracts sponsors, and new drivers and so on.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

Hi Craig,

The problem is that the majority of the crowd isn't aware of all of the controversy. Most of them aren't very knowledged about drifting, and are there just to see what it is or get their dose of eye candy.

Those of us who keep up to date with the message boards or talk regularly with the usual competitors are the only ones who understand what is going on.

Somebody told me about what happened with the drag racing scene... how it started with a bunch of privateers who then got sponsored. Then big manufacturers came into the scene, pouring tons of money into cars and now it is virtually impossible for the weekend racer to try and get into the sport, because they don't have the money to compete with these companies.

This is something I never want to see happen with drifting, and I think that's why D1 has made it very clear that they want street style cars competing. All the cars retain their original chassis, they all retain their catalytic converters, and they all have rear exit mufflers. I mean, sure some of these cars are 500-600hp, but they have restrictions so that the car can only get so powerful or so light. The sky is NOT the limit in terms of fabrication technology, so there is always a good display of pure driver skill.