Streched Tires; (What does this do?)

[BooZTT]

I agree it's retarded..which is why as you saw..I edited my posts to be more PC since that's how we have to be these days.

[Ghost of Duluth]

PC is good.

Stretching the tires, as I have always known it, is to keep the sidewall flex down during hard cornering. The more your tire flexes, the more the car rolls to the side under a load increasing the probability of you going the wrong way. What good is a stiff suspension and larger anti-roll bars if your car is still going to pitch due to high sidewall tires. Same reasoning as going from a 75 series tire to a 40 series tire. Less sidewall to flex. Also falls under the same reasoning as putting higher pressure in your tires. Less flex, less death from hitting a tree.

[GRiDRaceTech]

On the street, if you're interested in grip and don't drift much or at all, stretched tires are not the way to go. They offer less compliance and less contact patch, thus they will be harder to control in grip situations. True, they might have artificially stiff sidewalls, but the tires were not made for that kind of fitment. Why not just buy a tire with a very stiff sidewall (aka the Falken Azenis Sport) and run less wide wheels? Oh, wait, I know... because you value form over function. On a non-drift vehicle, there is no functional point to having stretched tires.
*Edit for GoD: Slightly more sidewall deflection is preferable to less contact patch. If you're driving hard on tires with floppy sidewalls, then I'd recommend not driving hard. Most high-performance street tires' sidewalls don't deflect too much and, even during deflection, the tires still grip very well due to the tire's compound being designed for said deflection. Increasing tire pressures will help reduce deflection, provided you leave them within the manufacturer's recommended specifications.*

In drifting, the stiffer sidewall, smaller tire sizes, and decreased contact patch are all pluses. I guess I just don't really understand fully the thought processes behind stretching a tire past its recommended boundaries.

BooZTT- My knowledge may be questioned, but it is sound.

(Don't even get me started on the excessive negative camber used by most drifters... )

[Ghost of Duluth]

That I can also agree with. More contact patch means more sticking on the street. So it stands to reason, more contact patch, stiffer sidewall tire, you stay on the road that much more and harder to break loose.

This falls under the personal preference thing. If you like it, do it, if you don't, don't. Simple as that.

[mk3mann]

man!!!!!

i didnt know about this topic AT ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!

this is great!

with my TOMS' wheels 17x8's front and 9's rear i dont need to spend the extra $$$ eh??

and better handaling b/c of the less tire flex!!!!! i have never thought of this before, nor have i ever given it a thought before!

hahaha


plus it looks cool....





I love the BEE-R wheels....they llook so nice

[BooZTT]

Originally posted by GRiDRaceTech
BooZTT- My knowledge may be questioned, but it is sound. Expand your horizons to include grip driving and you'll see my fascination with contact patch. (Don't even get me started on the excessive negative camber used by most drifters... )

Just for a second imagine that we are at a website called "Drifting.com". And that the question asked just might have been related to drifting. And before you go saying things about people that you REALLY obviously don't know..bite your tounge. You have no idea who I am or what racing history I have..so your assumtions could bite back. I'm saying this in the nicest way possible and so that the moderators find this post "PC". You sir, have some things to learn..regardless of what you may already know and no matter WHAT version of motorsports it is related to. Open your mind and quite making assumtions about people who you obviously don't know..I'm not some 14 year old without a liscense drifting on GT3 whos never even changed a tire or the oil in his Daddy's car. Maybe you should ask around..before you say things about people..my horizons are more expanded than you could possibly imagine.

[mk3mann]

what about under HARD cornering....

will the bead of the tire come off the rim??

is that a possibility???

thats what i have always thought



well the beads are strong

[Ghost of Duluth]

Yes, that is a possibility, of course that is a posibility with all tires. The reason tires break bead as it's called is because under a heavy load they flex to one side in effect pulling the bead off the rim. A good example of this is Rockcrawling or Desert off road. They run bead locks on their rims because of the extreme low tire pressures they have to run to get grip. They run those low tire pressures to make more of a contact patch. If anyone here has seen a Rockcrawler in action, it is breathtaking. I rode in one up Rattle Rock in Knoxville. Some of these rocks are almost a tall as I am. It is something else.

The way a bead works is this. It is a metal heavy guage wire inside the tire that pops over the bead on the wheel. It then uses the strength of it and the tire pressure to hold it there. So if it flexs, it cause opposite force to be applied to the bead therefore pulling it off the inside of the rim. So the smaller the sidewall and the more pressure you run, the stiffer that sidewall is. A smaller sidewall actually creates a better contact patch because it doesn't allow the tire to "Roll" to one side and off of the contact patch. So basically with a stretched tire you are doing all of that. Creating a stiffer sidewall, eliminating some roll and keeping the contact patch to the ground more.

I am in love with your car BootII. I want some photo's of it.

[TRusst]

AHHH! That R32 is sick! I got a birthday coming around again in February...So if anybody wants to buy me that I'd be ok with it.

I'm no expert but I do have a little understanding about this. There is an old addage in racing, it goes something like "You grip on two and slide one four." That is why for drifting we have higher spring rates than do more conventional "grip" machines.

In normal racing, it is essential to know if it is going to be a wet or dry race. If it is raining or going to rain it requires a far different and softer setup for the car. Since the water has eliminated much of the surfaces grip, the the anti roll bars, spring rates, damping rates and tire pressures have to be softened to allow the cars weight to transfer, and push down on the outside tires so that the car will have the traction it needs to get through the corner.

This is just sort of an illustration...but a drift car setup for a dry track on a dry track behaves similarly to a race car setup for a dry track but on a wet track. Maybe not that extreme, but similar.

Look at Hubinettes Viper. I recently read that he runs 600lb springs on the front and 1000lb springs on the rear. This setup is just the opposite of a front engine rear drive race car. On a Viper set up for road racing you would want a softer spring on the rear than on the front to allow the weight of the car to more easily push down on the rear tires to increase traction. Tires are essential in this equation as tire pressure, and side wall stiffness are part of the equation when it comes to figuring out spring rates and dampening rates...Regardless if it is drift or grip!

I would guess that stretching tires would depend on the driver/car combination. What feels right to you. All you can do is experiment and test, and if you have any way to aquire data aside from the hands, feet, hands, and butt, look at that too.

[TRusst]

Drag racers also have special rims that allow them to use screws to fasten the bead of the tire to the rim, because they also run extremely low tire pressures...which allows the tire to mush into the surface and increase surface area. Of course, they don't have too many corners to speak of.

[Ghost of Duluth]

Mu butt is an excellent data logger. The "Ghostrear 2000".
The reason Drag racers do it is so they do not spin the rim inside the tire. Bead locks do the same thing, just for different reasons that off road vehicles.

Good to see you Trust, haven't seen you in a while.

[GRiDRaceTech]

Mk3mann- Don't forget to read why I don't recommend stretched tires on the street. If you don't trust me, go ahead and search for my posts... you'll find that I have the credentials.

[mk3mann]

Originally posted by GRiDRaceTech
Mk3mann- Don't forget to read why I don't recommend stretched tires on the street. If you don't trust me, go ahead and search for my posts... you'll find that I have the credentials.

BooZTT- I am done with you, "sir."

can you explain yoru position in short??

what kind of expeiriance do you have with the situation???

[ACDSupra7]

Instead of arguing about it over the internet, why doesn't everyone just try it and learn from it

[05m0515]