Should TRUCKS be allowed to drift?

[henessy]

I Vote YES!!!!!

Trucks should be allowed to drift because the whole set up of a OEM truck can be somewhat complicated, but it can be modified to work. Drifting is a sport. In sports there come challenges. Setting up a truck to drift is a challenge. I like challenges .

[Peter]

you can attempt to make personal attacks but that does not change my opinion that trucks should not be allowed to compete in drifting events. Sure they should be allowed to practice as well as any fwd car, bike, trike that pays the fee for that mater, maybe in the future even competitions for a special class like fwd drift comp or truck drift comp or suv drift comp. But a truck tandem in a competition with a corolla, no.

I agree that we should all bin any attempts at personal attacks and other such bull$hit, but that's the only area we currently agree (oh, and I'm with ya that the leaf spring thing was bad, but only for you 'cuz it seemed to really deflate your argument and get you publicly served up by some of the truck boys 'round these parts/forums...).

Let's focus on your "but a truck tandem in a competition with a corolla, no" comment. Why not?

I attended every FD event last year and think we'll all agree that one of the, if not THE, best tandem runs in all of drifting was Pfeiffer's Corolla alongside (and sometimes in the grass to do so...) the Viper. That, by your logic, is a more fair and acceptable situation than if Sam had been wheeling the same semi-tube chassis, V10 powered machine fitted with composite SRT-10 bodywork in place of the composite Viper Competition Coupe bodywork?

Please explain. Thanks!


Peter Stark
MediaWide Marketing LLC
stark@mediawidemarketing.com

[Appleseed]

Let's not forget that Chevy had coils on all 4 corners of their 2wd trucks from 1962-1972. In fact, the rear arm design is the basis for all of the cars in NASCAR today.

[Ris4drift]

I attended every FD event last year and think we'll all agree that one of the, if not THE, best tandem runs in all of drifting was Pfeiffer's Corolla alongside (and sometimes in the grass to do so...) the Viper. That, by your logic, is a more fair and acceptable situation than if Sam had been wheeling the same semi-tube chassis, V10 powered machine fitted with composite SRT-10 bodywork in place of the composite Viper Competition Coupe bodywork?

Please explain. Thanks!


Peter Stark
MediaWide Marketing LLC
stark@mediawidemarketing.com

tube frame modifications are illegal in formula drift. also i have never owned a truck, in fact everythign i have raced in my life was an import. however what i thought was common basic knowledge is taht leaf springs are an old school inferior design that was often used on cars back in teh day. but i guess not everyone knows that by reading some peoples posts in this thread...btw my 188 u , an el camino weighs more than some compact trucks just fyi. does that make it unsafe?

[my 1 88 u]

why? What is your reasoning? That's what i'm trying to understand

If you meant for your question to be rhetorical and will not accept any dissenting opinions from your own, why did you choose create this thread in the first place?

[CrazyHawaiian]

um, no. Trucks share the same suspension as many cars, and many cars have the same type of frame/unibody as trucks.

If we're comparing trucks to the cars that currently compete in drifting competitions (which would be majority imports), I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. There are not many leaf spring style suspension cars that compete in the drifting scene, if any. And not many cars that compete in drifting competitions have real full frames. Majority of them have a unibody frame. I'm sure a truck could be built that would be competitive, but IMO the determining factor on how competitive they could be would be based on how the rulebook is written. Mainly the rules on modifying the suspension. I have friends that have converted their truck from leaf springs to 4 link rear w/ panhard bar and coilovers on all corners and it rocks. But I dunno if that would fit within the rules of the major drifting competitions.

[drz]

If we're comparing trucks to the cars that currently compete in drifting competitions (which would be majority imports), I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. There are not many leaf spring style suspension cars that compete in the drifting scene, if any. And not many cars that compete in drifting competitions have real full frames. Majority of them have a unibody frame. I'm sure a truck could be built that would be competitive, but IMO the determining factor on how competitive they could be would be based on how the rulebook is written. Mainly the rules on modifying the suspension. I have friends that have converted their truck from leaf springs to 4 link rear w/ panhard bar and coilovers on all corners and it rocks. But I dunno if that would fit within the rules of the major drifting competitions.

The "what's currently used for drifting today" argument is beside the point. A more valid perspective would be to compare a truck to other cars that would obviously be allowed into drifting competitions. For instance, 70's Camaros have leaf-spring rear suspensions, and they certainly will not be kept from competing. The Chevrolet Corvette from 1953 to present (even the new C6) do not have a uni-body and use full frames like a truck, and they will not be prevented from competing either. Neither would a Holden Comedor Ute (based on the Commador, aka GTO) for being a car with a truck bed put on the back.

The only things I see that would be reason for preventing a truck from competing in drift competitions is 1 - rollover hazard unless they are sufficiently lowered (needed to be competitive anyways) and 2 - excessive weight for full-size models that could overcome safey barriers or be a hazard to lighter sports cars such as the Corrolla in Tandem competition. But then again, the same could be said for a 5000lb. Mercedes (even AMG sport models) or V12 Jaguars. What we're really talking about here are the compact and mid-sized trucks anyways, because it's foolish to think that a 4500lb. vehicle of any type (car or truck) could be competitive in drifting anyways.

[Ris4drift]

There are not many leaf spring style suspension cars that compete in the drifting scene, if any. And not many cars that compete in drifting competitions have real full frames. Majority of them have a unibody frame.

a MAJORITY of the cars being used TODAY are nissan S chassis, and ae86. there is no variety whatsoever so using todays "popular" drift cars isnt the best illustration since "main" drift cars are basically counted on one hand.

I'm sure a truck could be built that would be competitive, but IMO the determining factor on how competitive they could be would be based on how the rulebook is written. Mainly the rules on modifying the suspension. I have friends that have converted their truck from leaf springs to 4 link rear w/ panhard bar and coilovers on all corners and it rocks. But I dunno if that would fit within the rules of the major drifting competitions.

i think the rulebook is pretty open about suspension, but it wouldnt be hard to alter it for somethign like this. i havent really looked but i would just use open modification with a maximum ride height


and about rollover i recently came across some videos of stock nissan titans/srt-10 trucks and some other stuff drifting. the titan i wouldnt allow but a compact truck i dont think would rollover as easy as everyone would think, but maybe the proffesionall accident investigation guy we know will shed some light on it....

[z28evans]

If you meant for your question to be rhetorical and will not accept any dissenting opinions from your own, why did you choose create this thread in the first place?

I'm all for dissenting opinions, and i would like to hear them. So far you have just said no, i just want to know a little more about your opinion. If your answer is just based on your feelings, that's fine. I was just hoping for a more detailed answer from you

I would like to see many different cars/ setups in drifting - not just go with what everyone else is doing. There is a lot of room for inovation in drifting. FWIW if we do go with a leaf-spring truck, i expect that we will be keeping it leaf sprung. Leaf springs can be made to work quite well.

james

[Drift For Food]

One more YES vote from me. My first rwd drifter was an old 2wd Ranger. It was a pos, but it worked...somewhat It was a lot of fun and could hold a drift if the traction was low enough(very low powered). Winter was best and it felt confident sliding around parking lots and back roads.

It's not the matter of can a truck drift. The matter revolves around can it compete . That is the question. In my mind, I'm seeing a big red NO , at least at a professional level. I don't think it would be possible to get the weight down or low enough to be competative. It would take a lot of work to counter these hinderances of the truck platform. They just aren't built light or low.

However, are they driftable, can they drift well and easily? Oh yeah. Sure they can...with a good setup. I just don't think they could be as fast. (Hmm, that just sounded wrong - fast and drifting together) Ok, I'll clarify a little. As long as the scoring doesn't decrease if the the car pulls away from the truck and only form is scored(control, angle, line, etc.), then yes, a truck could be competative as long as speed is not a factor.

[Peter]

tube frame modifications are illegal in formula drift.

Yeah I know, and it's clear you missed the point which I attempted to base off of a situation I thought we'd all be familiar with and understand...since you didn't, let's try this - what about Kumakubo's S13 truck? Would you oppose the presence/appearance of that?

Since you're probably gonna say no, you'd be honored to be in the company of said driver and vehicle, be careful when offering up some half-baked attempt at justification centering on it being a car converted to a truck as this also applies quite directly to the El Camino you're opposing...


Peter Stark
MediaWide Marketing LLC
stark@mediawidemarketing.com

[Ris4drift]

Yeah I know, and it's clear you missed the point which I attempted to base off of a situation I thought we'd all be familiar with and understand...since you didn't, let's try this - what about Kumakubo's S13 truck? Would you oppose the presence/appearance of that?

Since you're probably gonna say no, you'd be honored to be in the company of said driver and vehicle, be careful when offering up some half-baked attempt at justification centering on it being a car converted to a truck as this also applies quite directly to the El Camino you're opposing...


Peter Stark
MediaWide Marketing LLC
stark@mediawidemarketing.com

yeah i totally opppose the el camino drifting. especially since i may be driving it next year...

i think you misread my posts
also the el camino situation isnt anythign close to the sil-truck, the elco came from the factory, the siltruck has the rear 1/4 windows , hatch, removed and the roof slightly modified to make a "cab" i guess youd call it. i took a good look at it when i saw it at sema b/c i have a s13 hatch parts car i was considering doing this to, as it seems pretty straight forward. however as far as safety on the siltruck my thoughts add nothing to this thread, so i will keep them to myself. the siltruck also doesnt have tube frame modifications i saw in any way/form. neither will it be competing in Formula Drift this year. but i honestly think your misereading my posts. i am not in opposition of drifting trucks in any way/form, im all for it. but from what you said and i quote

"That, by your logic, is a more fair and acceptable situation than if Sam had been wheeling the same semi-tube chassis, V10 powered machine fitted with composite SRT-10 bodywork in place of the composite Viper Competition Coupe bodywork? "

is where i said no tube frame in FD, as for an example you threw out hte idea of a NASCAR craftsman truck type drift vehicle, composite truck body thrown over a viper chassis (would look nothign like a srt-10 truck in teh end). what z28evans is discussing here is a compact size modern truck vehicle, built for drifting (gutted street vehicle with heavy steering/suspension/engine/safety modifications) NOT a corvette c5R with a s-10 body grafted onto it like you described. so could you be clear on the point you were tryign to make? because obviously i missed it


michael peters
mike@bubbadrift.com

[CrazyHawaiian]

I dont know if you are misunderstanding me or what, but I wasnt trying to imply that trucks shouldn't be allowed to compete or leaf suspension sucks. I would like to see trucks compete as well, I think it would be good for the sport. The only reason I replied to that quote is because it sounded like the author is trying to validate that trucks should be allowed to compete because they share suspension and frame design with many other cars. If I am mistaken then I apologize, but if is that your reasoning then I stand by what I said. I dont think thats a valid reason because I dont agree with the statement in general. Regardless of what you want to compare the truck to (what is currently used to drift, or what could be used to drift), I dont think that their suspension and/or frames are similar to many other cars out there. Yes there are some examples out there with similar suspension and full frames (mostly older domestics), but there are not very many of them, and even less in the drifting scene. Compared to the large number of other cars that are used to drift, or could be used to drift (domestic, import, and european), its a very very small group of cars. I'm not saying they're junk, or they shouldnt be allowed to compete. I am saying they are different and unique. And in my opinion their likeness or difference of suspension / frame design is not a big issue as far as deciding weather or not they should be allowed to compete. Trucks were not designed to drift, and neither were the cars that are used today, so I dont see what the problem would be.

I think they should be allowed to compete simply because there is interest in the idea. If trucks started winning all the competitions or hurting people because of safety issues, then I would question the idea. But until that happens, I think its a great idea and if thats what you guys want to do, I say go for it. I have seen guys drifting trucks at our Drift Sessions and I know it would work. All of them were mini's (Toyota's or Mazda's) and they were able to drift with the rear leaf suspension fine. It did look like weight distribution was an issue, alot of guys had understeer issues, but I'm sure that could be worked out.

[drz]

Fair enough, CrazyHawaiian. And thanks to everyone for the replies. This thread wasn't intended to justify a truck in drifting, more a probe to see what kind of reception/response the idea got. And from the looks of it, it's pretty positive. The rules haven't been released yet, so we're still optimistic that trucks, or at least compact trucks will be allowed in FD.

[NismoSigma]

The way I see it is that, if it has 4 wheels should be able to drift. Whoever disagrees, well than Good Day cause you have obviously never seen a truck drift.

PS- I said bed because a car and truck are just transportation. Never meant in the means of technology.