(TV DEAL) D1GP Signs with FOX - Largest Media Deal in the History of Drifting

[Brian]

I have a question.

Which tires are banned in D1 and which are banned in FD?

[FreeThinker]

Driftbox type items has been around for a while and it actually can cause more controversy than less. Again, follow up with you fellow drifters on this. But I will say and acknowledge that GPS and data boxes may have some valid uses in drifting and it could be a future element for live event and TV. We actually invested in testing a system over the past few years and why we know some of the applications are great and others actually cause more issues.

The representatives of a certain company at PRI last year actually shared the REAL reason FD abandoned plans to use a computerized meansurement system. During their meeting with FD, someone from FD actually said that with a computerized judging system, there would be no ability to alter results.

Just like FD has many times altered the top16 ladder after qualifying. These days though, you guys just figure out the ladder before you release qualifying scores....

Now that we have established we don't change dates and how stupid that would be do to,

So it's a big coincidence that FD dates/locations conflicted with over 75% of the D1 dates in 2007??? And D1 released their calendar well before yours....

can you explain how we take money from drivers? As a matter of fact we have helped many drivers with deals to fund their presence in FD and furthermore we provide tire sponsors deeply discounted sponsor packages so that they can achieve their marketing goals through the series and still have $ to support teams. Again, you only need to look at the many examples of this in the series to understand facts.

Are you even aware of the policies of the company for which you work? FD requires every competitor to use tires from a series tire sponsor. If I remember correctly you wanted Kumho to pay nearly $200,000 to be a series sponsor in 2007 when this rule took effect. When they couldn't justify the investment their team was forced to switch to a new tire supplier which didn't have a tire nearly as good as the EcstaMX....

You really think practices such as this HELP teams??

Same goes for the guys who were on Dunlops...

Again, why is the support from a driver, team and sponsor perspective lopsidedly on our side. If we are what you say we are and do what you say you do, logic would tell you that all those drivers, teams and sponsors would not want to be in the series.

If you run a race team as a business, then you are forced to try and keep everyone happy until a better alternative series for your teams appears. You don't have the support you think you do from teams, drivers and sponsors, it's that FD has been the only option and therefore you can dictate however you want to.

If over the last 5 years your organization had focused all this effort on improving your series, helping your teams and catering to fans, rather than putting the energy into destroying possible competitors, then D1 wouldn't even be a threat to you and this whole discussion wouldn't be taking place.

[Jim @ FD]

The representatives of a certain company at PRI last year actually shared the REAL reason FD abandoned plans to use a computerized meansurement system. During their meeting with FD, someone from FD actually said that with a computerized judging system, there would be no ability to alter results.

Just like FD has many times altered the top16 ladder after qualifying. These days though, you guys just figure out the ladder before you release qualifying scores....







So it's a big coincidence that FD dates/locations conflicted with over 75% of the D1 dates in 2007??? And D1 released their calendar well before yours....



Are you even aware of the policies of the company for which you work? FD requires every competitor to use tires from a series tire sponsor. If I remember correctly you wanted Kumho to pay nearly $200,000 to be a series sponsor in 2007 when this rule took effect. When they couldn't justify the investment their team was forced to switch to a new tire supplier which didn't have a tire nearly as good as the EcstaMX....

You really think practices such as this HELP teams??

Same goes for the guys who were on Dunlops...




If you run a race team as a business, then you are forced to try and keep everyone happy until a better alternative series for your teams appears. You don't have the support you think you do from teams, drivers and sponsors, it's that FD has been the only option and therefore you can dictate however you want to.

If over the last 5 years your organization had focused all this effort on improving your series, helping your teams and catering to fans, rather than putting the energy into destroying possible competitors, then D1 wouldn't even be a threat to you and this whole discussion wouldn't be taking place.

This was a fairly health discussion about the facts and figures claimed by D1. And of course threads will lead into other topics and people flame, etc etc. business as usual. BUT if you are going start throwing out hearsay and talk gossip style then I would say you should just stop right now. You guys know who I am, no hiding behind an alias. My name is Jim Liaw, I am the co-founder of FD and I was the one that took a meeting with DriftBox about 2+ years ago. I was also one of the guys that was working with Motec to develop a better, more accurate system then DriftBox. So if some is saying that I said we alter results, I guarantee I did not. May those people that are hiding and chattering should step forward to tell me who they are so we can bring forth some truth.

In 2007, we already had dates, but unlike the previous D1 group, we do not release dates on venues until we have signed contracts. So really, internally we had the dates already before D1 even released theirs. And if everyone is against FD then why should you care about a date conflict between a D1 date on the East Coast and a FD date on the West Coast. Trust me we'd rather not have conflicting dates for the sake of companies that try to attend both series.

$200,000 from Kumho... again tell me who said what because I'll tell you that I see 99% of all proposals our sales team send out and we did not send one for $200k.

You have every right to disagree about how we do things but please try to keep facts facts and hearsay hearsay.

I like to think we have had a fairly open door to everyone, media, fans, critics, drivers, sponsors, etc. We do not practice in banning drivers, we do not take a dictatorship like approach, we do not cast our drivers like Taniguchi and Orido because they drove in a demo with FD. And i strongly believe that if truly the FD field had an issue with something, we would openly work to correct it and make it better. So FreeThinker, if you think so poorly of us, please submit a list of FD drivers that feel the same way and submit a list of companies in the industry that feel the same way and I will personally contact each and everyone of them to hear them out.

[MonkeySlide]

This was a fairly health discussion about the facts and figures claimed by D1. And of course threads will lead into other topics and people flame, etc etc. business as usual. BUT if you are going start throwing out hearsay and talk gossip style then I would say you should just stop right now. You guys know who I am, no hiding behind an alias. My name is Jim Liaw, I am the co-founder of FD and I was the one that took a meeting with DriftBox about 2+ years ago. I was also one of the guys that was working with Motec to develop a better, more accurate system then DriftBox. So if some is saying that I said we alter results, I guarantee I did not. May those people that are hiding and chattering should step forward to tell me who they are so we can bring forth some truth.

In 2007, we already had dates, but unlike the previous D1 group, we do not release dates on venues until we have signed contracts. So really, internally we had the dates already before D1 even released theirs. And if everyone is against FD then why should you care about a date conflict between a D1 date on the East Coast and a FD date on the West Coast. Trust me we'd rather not have conflicting dates for the sake of companies that try to attend both series.

$200,000 from Kumho... again tell me who said what because I'll tell you that I see 99% of all proposals our sales team send out and we did not send one for $200k.

You have every right to disagree about how we do things but please try to keep facts facts and hearsay hearsay.

I like to think we have had a fairly open door to everyone, media, fans, critics, drivers, sponsors, etc. We do not practice in banning drivers, we do not take a dictatorship like approach, we do not cast our drivers like Taniguchi and Orido because they drove in a demo with FD. And i strongly believe that if truly the FD field had an issue with something, we would openly work to correct it and make it better. So FreeThinker, if you think so poorly of us, please submit a list of FD drivers that feel the same way and submit a list of companies in the industry that feel the same way and I will personally contact each and everyone of them to hear them out.

Finally!

I was waiting for this. So much BS in this thread has been about heresay and conversations that no one else knows about except the poster.

Let D1 do its thing and let FD do theirs...can't we just leave it at that?

[Brian]

So, what about the tires?

What brand tires are banned and why?

[OldSkool510]

I LOVE IT!!!!!! All this pre-event hype and drama is creating quite a stir in the world of drifting. With the 2 upcoming events only a month apart, I hope both FD and D1 are scrapping their current plans and going for broke in Long Beach and Anaheim. Hopefully, we'll get to see the baddest drifting events ever. Thank god I live in SoCal.

[Cavi Mike]

Formula D, just shut up for once. Please. No more of your political hate because that's all it is. You can try to act as calm and civil as you want but you just hate and hate and hate so please stop denying it. The more you ramble on about how you "disagree" with the D1 way of things (when they are none of your business anyways) just makes me dislike FD that much more.

Who made you Judge, Jury and Executioner anyways?

[FreeThinker]

So, what about the tires?

What brand tires are banned and why?

FormulaD 2008 rulebook:
Section 9.2 APPROVED TIRES
Only tires listed in Appendix C will be allowed. Teams who wish to use any size, model, or
brand not specified here must file for petition and gain approval from FORMULA DRIFT.


Here is appendix C on page 36:

APPENDIX C - APPROVED TIRES
(document available from FORMULA DRIFT or at www.formulad.com)

So I go to FormulaD.com........... I don't see any specific mention of what tires are allowed Then I click here:

http://www.formulad.com/sponsors/

Tire Suppliers: Bridgestone, Falken, MAXXIS, Toyo, Federal, Yokohama

Co-sponsors: BFGoodrich, Cooper,Hankook, Nitto

So I'm guessing anything other than those tires are banned.

But I know you want to hear it from Jim, Andy, or Ryan. I would love to hear it from them also.

Also Jim, if $200,000 is not what you guys asked Kumho to pay to become a series sponsor, then how much do you charge a tire company to become a sponsor, or "supplier" ?

And if I want to come to your series and drive on the Pirelli tires currently on my car, why should Pirelli have to give your organization thousands of dollars to become a sponsor before I am allowed to run their tires??? THAT is supposed to be helping teams and driver?? Are you serious?

[Brian]

lol FREETHINKER, should I go pick up a camera from "presenting sponsor", Circuit City?

That page is all old and out of date.

What is the 2009 lineup for tires?

I run Dunlops on the front of my car. If those are illegal, I don't plan to try out for Formula D.

[domodomo]

who made you judge, jury and executioner anyways?

I am the Liawwwwwwww!!!!!

[OldSkool510]

Let D1 do its thing and let FD do theirs...can't we just leave it at that?

D1 was doing their thing, remember? FD is the one who came in and put their "information police" badge on.

Yes, of course we are concerned with what they announce. They have a forum where people listen and hear what they say and when those things are false, that is spreading disinformation. What we presented were facts on what TV content has come to market so disinformation doesn't run rampant and ultimately hurt the fan.

We don't hate on D1, we just disagree with how they do things. There is a big difference between those two things.

D1 was posting their usual sh*t when someone from FD chimed in and tried to regulate and police what they were saying.

I wonder if Mr. Liaw gave the guy posting for FD the green light to speak on behalf of FD. Whoever it was sure knows the ins and out of the business.

If he didn't have the green light, I wonder if Mr. Liaw gave him his walking papers?

[Formula D]

D1 was posting their usual sh*t when someone from FD chimed in and tried to regulate and police what they were saying.

I wonder if Mr. Liaw gave the guy posting for FD the green light to speak on behalf of FD. Whoever it was sure knows the ins and out of the business.

If he didn't have the green light, I wonder if Mr. Liaw gave him his walking papers?

This is Ryan Sage, the other co-founder of FD.

Regarding tires.... yes, for tires to be used by a competitor, the must be a tire supplier. This is not an uncommon thing in motor sports and done to protect those that are investing in the series and also not a topic for a forum where you could never eloquently have a casual observer understand certain aspects of the series. But again, here is my direct line, call and lets talk 562.901.2600 ex.5

Formula D, just shut up for once. Please. No more of your political hate because that's all it is. You can try to act as calm and civil as you want but you just hate and hate and hate so please stop denying it. The more you ramble on about how you "disagree" with the D1 way of things (when they are none of your business anyways) just makes me dislike FD that much more.

As you wish Cavimike

I am the Liawwwwwwww!!!!!

Hi Rich

[Brian]

The tire thing is pretty shitty, but understandable.
As a business, you need to make sure you maximize profit. Don't want to piss off the people already putting money into it.

good info.

What about shaving the letters off the sidewall? Is that ok?

[OldSkool510]

Hey Mr. Sage,

Do you have any second thoughts or regrets about posting on this topic? This opened up a big can of worms for FD don't you think? Regardless, will the competition between FD and D1 cause you think bigger and better for all the upcoming events this year?

Hope you reply for all us fans out here. FD and D1 is still getting my money in SoCal.

[MonkeySlide]

I don't like it when the grown-ups fight!

Seriously though objectively speaking there are valid points to both sides really.

D1: Even though things were a bit vague at first once everything was understood it was a bit over-boisterous. I'm glad you're going to be on TV but "biggest deal in history" ahhh a bit much yes?


Formula D: In all honesty even if there was any mis-information or exaggeration in D1's press release...being in the position that you are perhaps it wasn't the best idea to pick it apart.

I don't think I'm the only one who could appreciate what you were trying to do but lets be real for a second. Anyone who cared about all of the points you brought up would have did the fact checking on their own.


I don't really feel that fans care about how many millions of homes may or may not have D1 or Formula D broadcasted to them. They just care about seeing it in THEIR home. That's just my opinion though.


None of what either party did here was nessasarily "wrong" but I think no matter which "side" you're on (I'm on neither) we can agree that some of the things both parties have done was UNnessasary..

I come to this conclusion because I choose to look at the results of this entire exhange.

Did D1 gain any new sponsors from this press release? I don't think so.

Does Formula D get anything out of pointing out what they feel were inaccuracies in D1's press release? No...unless you want to count people accusing them of sour grapes.

So all in all most of this thread was a lot of energy put fourth by several people to no significant end. I hope that both sides will realize that and stop wasting their time on this.