American Drifting heading the wrong direction?

[nissanguy_24]

oh yeah pony there practically stock! *eye roll* i mean afterall 5 inches difference is nothing... not to mention they made a 2 door race car and called it a 4 door street car. of course i could mention the drive train and power plants too but i think you made my point well enough.

[pony]

Originally posted by mercutio
Wheelbase on Nextel Cup stockers is 110 inches, on the Busch Series cars it's 105 inches. I'm not sure what the wheelbase of the Taurus, Monte, and Intrepid are, but I'm pretty sure they're not all 110 inches. And the bodies are now spec bodies designed by NASCAR itself, with the only differences being the front and rear bumpers. The last stock car to look anything like its production counterpart was the '97 Thunderbird (also the last street version of a stock car to be RWD and have a V8), which had a 113 inch wheelbase but the hood and trunk were identical to. Even before the switch to the spec body, the side profiles of the Taurus and Intrepid were radically different from their street versions because if the B-pillar were left in the stock location it would have been too difficult for the drivers to exit through the window. So NASCAR let Ford and Dodge move the B-pillar rearward to make the cars look more like two-doors and create a larger window opening. Yes, stock cars used to be modified production vehicles, but that ended a long time ago. And if anyone can tell me which Ford I can buy with a 351 V8 in it, I'd love to know. Don't get me wrong, I love watching NASCAR racing, but to imply that anything is remotely stock is just wrong.

they still use the factory metal roofs and pillars. the body is pretty close to the stock body of their car of choice. see the fourth paragraph of my most.

[mercutio]

Wheelbase on Nextel Cup stockers is 110 inches, on the Busch Series cars it's 105 inches. I'm not sure what the wheelbase of the Taurus, Monte, and Intrepid are, but I'm pretty sure they're not all 110 inches. And the bodies are now spec bodies designed by NASCAR itself, with the only differences being the front and rear bumpers. The last stock car to look anything like its production counterpart was the '97 Thunderbird (also the last street version of a stock car to be RWD and have a V8), which had a 113 inch wheelbase but the hood and trunk were identical to. Even before the switch to the spec body, the side profiles of the Taurus and Intrepid were radically different from their street versions because if the B-pillar were left in the stock location it would have been too difficult for the drivers to exit through the window. So NASCAR let Ford and Dodge move the B-pillar rearward to make the cars look more like two-doors and create a larger window opening. Yes, stock cars used to be modified production vehicles, but that ended a long time ago. And if anyone can tell me which Ford I can buy with a 351 V8 in it, I'd love to know. Don't get me wrong, I love watching NASCAR racing, but to imply that anything is remotely stock is just wrong.

[pony]

Originally posted by nissanguy_24
I dont see where im wrong in my statement. And your telling me the body lines and wheel base match those of the car there based off? In that case theres some pretty wild ford tauruses running around. The only thing those cars have in common with there stock "counter parts" is a name and badge.


Well, sence you just like to argue with me, it seems. feel free to dig up numbers on the wheel bases of the nascars and lets say the dodge stock counter parts, oh provide some pictures too. We will see how similar they are.

To run a car in Winston Cup competition, the car is required to be available to the public as a consumer production model. Both the Pontiac Grand Prix and Chevrolet Monte Carlo have counterparts available to the public. The Ford Taurus is also available to the public but in a four-door model only.

The fact that the Taurus comes as a four-door is an important point to note because of the other requirement of a car type. The general profile of a production model is theoretically intended to be maintained in a race-car profile. The specific guideline is that the hood, roof, and rear-deck surfaces should resemble the consumer unit.

In the case of the GM passenger car, the profile is roughly equivalent to the race car, but because the street Taurus comes only as a four-door, some allowances were necessary to make a race version of it. This happened when the Thunderbird was phased out, and the Taurus became the car Ford put forward. The big difference is that the production four-door has a roof that is taller than the race version.

The process of making the body for a NASCAR race car is incredibly labor-intensive. The shape of the car is mostly determined by NASCAR rules. These rules are encapsulated in a set of 30 templates, each shaped to fit a different contour of the car. For instance, the biggest template fits over the center of the car from front to back. When the template is laid on the car, the gap between the template and the car cannot exceed the specified tolerance. Each template is marked on its edge with a colored line. If the line is red, then the gap must be less than 0.07 inches (0.18 cm). If the line is blue, the gap must be less than 0.25 inches (0.64 cm). If the line is green, the gap must be less than 0.5 inches (1.27 cm). The templates actually allow a little leeway in the design of the car. Because 30 templates are not enough to cover every inch of the body, some areas between template locations are not strictly controlled by NASCAR.

Many or most teams use the roof and windshield post sheet metal from factory production to obtain proper profile and height as these parts are difficult to form by hand. The hoods, roofs, and trunk lids come from the auto manufacturers, and the "floor pans" (floorboards) are stamped from an original mold and are provided by suppliers. The bumpers can come either from the manufacturer or an "aftermarket" supplier.

taken from www.tricklefan.com

the only real major difference is that th west series is allowed to have a 110 inch wheelbase with the north series having a 105 inch wheelbase.

OOOOH, big differences from their street counterparts.

[nissanguy_24]

Originally posted by pony
actually youre wrong. Stock car racing WAS in fact showroom stock cars until entries like the Daytona Superbird and Grand National completely ripped up the competition. So before manufacturers started building passenger cars with super high output 393s from the factory, they decided to make the powertrains of stock cars the same to level out the competition.,

So now its a replicated body of a production car. the wheelbase, track and body lines match those of the car they are based off.

I dont see where im wrong in my statement. And your telling me the body lines and wheel base match those of the car there based off? In that case theres some pretty wild ford tauruses running around. The only thing those cars have in common with there stock "counter parts" is a name and badge.


Well, sence you just like to argue with me, it seems. feel free to dig up numbers on the wheel bases of the nascars and lets say the dodge stock counter parts, oh provide some pictures too. We will see how similar they are.

[pony]

Originally posted by nissanguy_24
My point being, they call it stock car racing, but the cars arent stock, nothing on the cars are stock. People who loved racing STOCK cars had there sport taken away by big sponsors. Drifting can easily do the same thing. Those who love drifitng can have our sport taken away by big sponsors and replaced withsomeone else wearing the same name.

actually youre wrong. Stock car racing WAS in fact showroom stock cars until entries like the Daytona Superbird and Grand National completely ripped up the competition. So before manufacturers started building passenger cars with super high output 393s from the factory, they decided to make the powertrains of stock cars the same to level out the competition.,

So now its a replicated body of a production car. the wheelbase, track and body lines match those of the car they are based off.

[OH240SE]

Not quite D1 level yet my friend,

I higly doubt anyone in FormulaD who has the skills so far could complete and win. Even in the Blasted Mopar Renta-Viper. altho that would be our best weapon so far, i'll shamely admit. Its funny that we consider horsepower over skill. Hell, put Gushi in the FordGT, Norris in a Vette, and Sam in that Viper. It would be interesting to watch, but we'd still be outclassing them by double the horses and barely hanging in it.

As Benson said in his post about the Girl Drifters...

"why can't GUYS drift like that here? haha!"

he has a good point, for the time that Drifting has been practiced and prefected over there, we are taking leaps and bounds to compete with them, but it'll be a while before the majority of us american would beat them. Same when Hideo Fukayama tried to compete in Nascar, look how well he did (crashing out half the time). Dirt-Track Stock Cars, that is our grassroot, drifting is theirs. I'm glad that we are changing styles and mixing it up, but its just a matter of experience and practice.

I'd love to see the FormulaD champion and the other top 2 places go over there and try to compete. Even tho I stick with my home country, i still doubt we could beat them.

Atleast for now....

[NismoSigma]

Drifting in USA is at the point were people are still experimenting for what car is good for drifting. In japan theyve had 20 or more years to find sutible cars so they can drift. They tested what they can find and they got the Silvia, AE86, RX7, etc. In america u see guys using old muscle cars, or hoopties. It might seem like it is heading in wrong direction, but main diffrence between Japan and USA is how they got promoted. In japan it was underground for a while, but in US, it just boomed so there isnt an underground scene. also in usa, people dont demand alot of action going on in a sport. look at nascar, just left turns and not alot of passing, in drifting its diffrent, lots of stuff goin on at once, this might confuse some americans but they will catch on. Drifting is not a fad, in 10 years they are gonna have a show on VH1 called i love the 2000's and in 2003 or 2004, theyre gonna talk about drifting. At this point it is unstoppable, it will continue to expand and we will learn from it, in about 10-20 years, americans and any1 else will be able to compete with the japananese but at this moment, americans are just learning, were in pre-school but we will graduate. Just stick with the sport, it'll all be good.

[LexmarkX73]

drifting will never be the same as it is in Japan. it took, what 20-30 years before the grassroots "touge" became a mainstream event (D1)? drifting has been in mainstream america a little over a year now, and its already at the D1 level with very few real enthusiests who understand the real meaning of drifting. its not meant to be a fad you go watch, it is supposed to be something you do. well ive rambled off long enough, but to end, i'll never really enjoy D1 as much as small events with people who make do with the cars they have, or just drive instead of watching others do it :P

[zdss14]

ya know it seems like most drifters arn't about all the mainstreem stuff as it is so if we put out that image about not being posers and what not, and make shure no one screws it up then it will all be ok, it's our sport so lets make it what we want it to be and not let other stuff make it something diffrent.

[MomoRocks]

What i think

to tell you the truth, this is how i think. I truly do think that drifting will go the wrong way in america. Look at racing, it was great but then you had hot shot punks that made racing pretty dumb. As much as i love racing and i dont hate civics, i see them every where. i think the same is gonna happen to dirfting. soon or a later the mainstream is gonna make it so big that everyone is gonna do it n then BAM!. again hot shot punks are gonna ruin it talkin their mouth off when they can only do so little. Stuff like this i love but when it goes mainstream, i see the downfall of it. i would really hate to see when everyone beocmes a "drifter" (or so they will say) when they dont even know what a AE86 is. It saddens me.

[parknglotdrfter]

haha parking lots work fine tho, but... thats only because thats the only place im allowed to drive and we dont have drift events down in texas very often

[mranlet]

To me there's nothing like having a mountian, some fun cars, some good friends, the night and no worries - It's that feeling you get on the last day of school when you are loving every second and wouldn't trade it for anything in the world, only it's there with you every time you hit the hill...

Originally posted by A.YEN
i really wish that one day we can all hang out on a turn one day and drift the nite away. i too still love the underground life because of the pleasure of driving. and we did hang out on a turn before but the cops got smart. geezs that would be the life. dont get me wron about underground, thats where i started and i will never forget what got me here today. its my roots

drive safe ANDY YEN SWINGBattle

That's all I wanted to hear

-MR

[marshun]

i dont think that americans are going in the wrong direction. or about the horsepower thing. its all about skill in the end.

but i've been reading about some events and seen some video's. it kinda seems some of the judges are biased. so.... idunno on that part. thats sketchy

[A.YEN]

i really wish that one day we can all hang out on a turn one day and drift the nite away. i too still love the underground life because of the pleasure of driving. and we did hang out on a turn before but the cops got smart. geezs that would be the life. dont get me wron about underground, thats where i started and i will never forget what got me here today. its my roots

drive safe ANDY YEN SWINGBattle