Drifting Pretty; (LA Weekly Article)

[marshun]

wait wait wait. what is the problem here? cause im not gettin it. it seems like some people are just taking offense to the little things.

[nissanguy_24]

Originally posted by Wickdmarz
it wasn't directed straight to you, just anyone with a team or club, that has been making fun of ours.

No but the last page or two of forum has been sparked by my comment. That little comment was made out to be some horrible insult at the people and familys who make Drifting Pretty Possible.. yet if you go back and look at my previous post when the real pre flame war conversation took place you will understand i mean no such insult. If you personally took offense i will apologise personally to you. But i ment no such insult.

[enrique]

Originally posted by nissanguy_24

I Want everyone to look at these two gentlemen You have heard me time and time again. As well as other respected members of our little site talk about the negative side to most drifters. This elitest idea that seems to ooze from them like a puss from an open wound. They think they are better then everyone. Not just drag racers or grip racers or anything, But other drifters, the worse part is they take a moral highground when there is really nothing under them to support the weight of there misdeeds that high.

I think your way off base here. I don't know benson personally but he doesn't seem to come off like that at all. I understand his stance on not supporting illegal street drifting. I used to be very involved in a big streetracing website. The site was a bandwidth cow that companies would love to get involved with for advertisment reasons. Now we weren't criminals but the fact that we covered illegal happenings kept sponsors away.

Benson has a bright future in drifitng. As do many other people, but sponsors don't want to be associated with anything illegal. Why do think in the fast and the furious the bad guys had some made up tires when there were name brands being tossed around like crazy.

[mav1178]

Then you are in no position to lecture ANY body. i am sick of that.. Oh i guess its just us "wanna bes"

Let's recap...

- back in the day, there were hardly any sanctioned events in the U.S. You "drift" at autocross, you get kicked out. You drift at a road race event, you get kicked out. That was before, that was how track owners in the U.S. treated drifting as a "sport". To them, it was people clowning around. Before Drift Day started in 2001 it was next to impossible to have a "legal" drift event. That was 4 years ago.
- aside from empty lots, "touge" was the only real place to hone skills.

Any questions? Or should it be spelled out letter by letter?

Let us think about that for a minute.. Want to bes.... what do we want to be? Is the implication from '97 S14 SE Turb And Bension that we "Want to be" like them? Yes because when i watch the drift bible i say under my breath "I want to have the longest running turbo ka24 in america" or "i want to be just like bension when i grow up". Yes if only i could..... Such a distant dream if only i could reach out and grab it...


Or perhaps the implication is no one but you two actually drift. We all just clutch on to our FF cars secretly wishing for the day when we can finally receive a 240sx or 86 from mom and day and go drift it all JDM style, you know... Just like takumi does!

Eh Or perhaps your implication is we should be like you Do it on the street until we are able to afford or able to use the track regularly then preach how awful the street is, and put people down.. actualy insult them when they even mention the IDEA of it.

Implicate all you want... I still fail to see what your point is. My point is the same as Benson's: if you want to drift, do it in a safe controlled environment. If you want to drift, be prepared to spend money. If you want to do it on the streets, accept responsibility for your own actions (and if you are a minor, have your parents keep you in check since you would screw your parents over if you get in trouble).

I Want everyone to look at these two gentlemen You have heard me time and time again. As well as other respected members of our little site talk about the negative side to most drifters. This elitest idea that seems to ooze from them like a puss from an open wound. They think they are better then everyone. Not just drag racers or grip racers or anything, But other drifters, the worse part is they take a moral highground when there is really nothing under them to support the weight of there misdeeds that high.

Come again? It's called "learning from other people's mistakes". Nowhere did I hear Benson say "I've never done touge". Nowhere did he deny where he learned his technique from. If there is ONE THING Benson can preach, he can preach the fact that drifting on the streets or even under unsupervised situations is dangerous and contributes to the overall problem. Don't make the same mistake others have made in the past... or perhaps that is too advanced of a concept for you guys to learn.

-alex

[nissanguy_24]

Originally posted by mav1178
or perhaps that is too advanced of a concept for you guys to learn.

-alex

Nice snide comment at the end.

Im not trying to defend illegal drifting I am attacking the whole elitest attitude that i've been watching.. And not all of those comments where directed at bension, i grouped two people in there remember?

The idea of suddenly attack good guys because "They arent doing it the right way" is very annoying to me. Most these guys wont like it. Hell i didnt like it and i wasnt even argueing the suposively benifits of learning on the streets. These guys brought up my minor role here as a moderator to show how horrible it was for a person of minor athority on one of the many drifting websites shouldnt have controversal opinions.

Yet they come down here, people.. especialy bension whos looked up to by many. Preaching about how we are all wannabes doing it the wrong way, while there doing it the right way... not saying the track is a bad idea. However dont you think these people with much much more influence in the drifting scene then me should tread alittle lighter? be friendly and sugestion people go to the tracks. Instead of insulting them and putting them down, starting flame wars on forums ect.. Yes we all contributed to it..

They are comming off as assholes. Thats why people are getting mad. Perhaps THEY should try to act more professional and mature when they preach the wonderful track days.. I hope they understand when these guys see that attitude they shy away from track days. They want to people looking down on them because there new, or not very good. God forbid it isnt a normal drift car, they might be called wannabes.

Theres an old saying about catching more flys with honey or something along those lines.. In other words if you want to help people you dont insult them.

[mav1178]

Yes i am a moderator but when i became a moderator i said i would not change the way i post.

Perhaps that's how things are around here, but I do have to disagree.

While it is okay for you to voice your opinion on threads, you do have to realize that when you chose to moderate you are being promoted to an elevated position for your forum. Like it or not, the way you post contributes to your credibility, and your ability and effectiveness to moderate is directly related to how much credibility you have over other members.

Much like police officers that enforce laws, if the cops are shady or not credible then it takes away from their effectiveness to enforce laws. Citizens might very well ignore cops in a lawless country...

I moderate the 240SX forums at Freshalloy.com and after I became moderator I had to pick and choose my words on highly opinionated matters that could cause unnecessary tension. Perhaps you guys run things differently around here (and if so, that's pretty sad for such a big website with good potential).

-alex

[Feint]

I guess all throw some say into this again.

If you were to sell crack and get rich off of it,who are you to tell people not to sell crack? When you tell someone to do the very thing that you done,it can come off as being nothing short of hypocrisy.Someone that has been down that road can suggest and give reason why you shouldn't do it,but to flat out tell you not to do it,are you going to truely listen to them? I know what he's getting at,but let's be real here.Would Benson be Benson without the touge past? Would he be as good as he is now? Would he know as much about cars? Just by reading sileightymania,I can safely say no.Face it,touge is less forgiving,forcing you to adapt and learn to things you probably wouldn't have learned otherwise,or as fast.I'm not going to carry out that argue though,it doesn't belong here.But my point is,driftings roots is in touge,even though it is illegal,you can't exempt it from drifting.It's responsible for making almost all of the pros who they are today, and what they are today.Any of them telling you to just forget it and go straight to the track can be seen as hypocritical.Especially when you have pros taking touge over tracks,what does tht show you? Defeats the whole purpose of bring it to the track attitude doesn't it?

['97 S14 SE Turb]

Originally posted by nissanguy_24
Eh if you think i need more tact then im glad you didnt see the first draft of this post.

EDIT: Actually i take that back, i dont care what you think.

So, which is it??? Looking at how you responed, you are being hypocritical...

[nissanguy_24]

Originally posted by mav1178

I moderate the 240SX forums at Freshalloy.com and after I became moderator I had to pick and choose my words on highly opinionated matters that could cause unnecessary tension. Perhaps you guys run things differently around here (and if so, that's pretty sad for such a big website with good potential).

-alex

I think any regular member of this site can attest to my credibility as you put it...

As for picking and choosing my words.. Go check out my Friend S13_steves post, then go check out mine on this thread.. Steve is a good guy who blurts out whatever is on his mind. The point is i do alot of picking and choosing. I let things out ocasionally i shouldnt but we all do that. As i mentioned early if only you guys saw the first draft of some of these post...

[nissanguy_24]

Originally posted by '97 S14 SE Turb
So, which is it??? Looking at how you responed, you are being hypocritical...

They call my hypocritical robert on other forums...

Here sence this whole thing started out because of my insulting drifting pretty and all it stands for i am going to post an e-mail i sent to one of the drifting pretty members after drift day 16. i dont think the recipient will mind because im not posting there response. But it was a positive one.

Hello,

I saw your car at drift day 16. And watched from the grandstands as you improved before everyone's eyes. Not bad at all for a open differential automatic. I have a automatic S13, i learned in very much the same way (though i blew the engine a few weeks ago) I believed the automatic taught me alot. Especialy weight transfer techniques that alot of guys with manuals STILL dont know. I wanted to say keep up the good work and keep improving. And i also wanted to know if you were using a foot braking technique into that first turn on the long course. It deffenately looked like it. Basic come in hot, tap the brake to transfer weight, turn in early, counter steer, carry it ect..

Anyways good luck in your future drifting endeavours.

- Robert Hale

Yes i am clearly an *Censored**Censored**Censored* who hates drifting pretty. You guys really need to get over your selfs.

EDIT: GASP! i used 'a' before a word that started with an 'o' instead of 'an'... Its probably a trait from hypocrite land.

[mav1178]

Yet they come down here, people.. especialy bension whos looked up to by many. Preaching about how we are all wannabes doing it the wrong way, while there doing it the right way... not saying the track is a bad idea. However dont you think these people with much much more influence in the drifting scene then me should tread alittle lighter? be friendly and sugestion people go to the tracks. Instead of insulting them and putting them down, starting flame wars on forums ect.. Yes we all contributed to it..

Actually, Mr. Moderator, you have it wrong... S13_Steve was the one who threw out the "legal vs. illegal" debate. Here you go...

Originally posted by S13_Steve
i think of this as a illegal vs legal drifters argument..... does anybody agree with this? i mean all the track drifters love DP but then think of the illegal drifters here.....

Then after that, Feint complained that Benson/Nadine might be hypocritical because of their past experiences at touge... then it snowballed from there.

So before you insult others, make sure you insult the RIGHT person.

-alex

[nissanguy_24]

Originally posted by mav1178
Actually, Mr. Moderator, you have it wrong... S13_Steve was the one who threw out the "legal vs. illegal" debate. Here you go...



Then after that, Feint complained that Benson/Nadine might be hypocritical because of their past experiences at touge... then it snowballed from there.

So before you insult others, make sure you insult the RIGHT person.

-alex

Didnt i say we were all responsible for this flame war?

This really isnt going anywhere. Honestly are you guys expecting us to all come out and apologise and mention you were right 100 percent and we were all wrong before you end this? I hope thats not what your waiting for.

I am going to close this thread soon for a few hours, to let everyone cool down, so make sure you all get your last words in soon.

['97 S14 SE Turb]

and some reading comprehension would help...

Look over what I've written. Think about it... You are misunderstanding me and making the wrong assumptions...

[Feint]

Originally posted by mav1178
Actually, Mr. Moderator, you have it wrong... S13_Steve was the one who threw out the "legal vs. illegal" debate. Here you go...



Then after that, Feint complained that Benson/Nadine might be hypocritical because of their past experiences at touge... then it snowballed from there.

So before you insult others, make sure you insult the RIGHT person.

-alex

I originally didn't bring in Benson,since this regarded Drift Pretty,NOT Benson.I pointed out what I saw contradicted with the article,I provided proof,in other words,I had an inrefutable point via concrete evidence.I'll be honest,Drift Pretty should probably be fighting their own fight then having someone else do it.We can point fingers all day,call names all day,argue all day,but at the end of the day,it's hard to tell someone not to do what your doing/have done.

[mav1178]

Originally posted by Feint
I guess all throw some say into this again.

If you were to sell crack and get rich off of it,who are you to tell people not to sell crack? When you tell someone to do the very thing that you done,it can come off as being nothing short of hypocrisy.Someone that has been down that road can suggest and give reason why you shouldn't do it,but to flat out tell you not to do it,are you going to truely listen to them? I know what he's getting at,but let's be real here.Would Benson be Benson without the touge past? Would he be as good as he is now? Would he know as much about cars? Just by reading sileightymania,I can safely say no.Face it,touge is less forgiving,forcing you to adapt and learn to things you probably wouldn't have learned otherwise,or as fast.I'm not going to carry out that argue though,it doesn't belong here.But my point is,driftings roots is in touge,even though it is illegal,you can't exempt it from drifting.It's responsible for making almost all of the pros who they are today, and what they are today.Any of them telling you to just forget it and go straight to the track can be seen as hypocritical.Especially when you have pros taking touge over tracks,what does tht show you? Defeats the whole purpose of bring it to the track attitude doesn't it?

you fail to see the point.

We all know Benson drifted at touge... but the question is, does he do it NOW? No.

Using your analogy: if a person sold crack, made money off it, but has since gotten past the "selling crack" phase and now preaches to young people to not sell crack, is that not a hypocrite in action?

There is one fundamental concept that is being overlooked here, and that is those that wish to start drifting NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE CONSEQUENCES OF THEIR ACTIONS. When people say touge is bad, they speak from experience. If you want to experience it first-hand, by all means go for it... it's your life, not mine or anyone else's.

But since there are SO MANY legal events you can go to to learn, there really is no excuse or justification for drifting at touge anymore. There really isn't. If you screw up or get caught at touge, it is YOUR FAULT. That is the bottom line, and the reason why Benson kept emphasizing that "there is no excuse".

Before if you messed up at touge and said "well that's b/c there are no legal events", that is understandable to the rest of the enthusiast population (although that won't hold up in a court of law). Nowadays if you screw up at touge, there would be no pity given.

-alex